CROONAERT Posted 1 November , 2005 Share Posted 1 November , 2005 Could anyone explain a couple of the entries in this AB64 extract for me , please? 1. What is the "Industrial group Number" (12) and... 2. What is the "Code number" (317)? Thanks, Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Stewart Posted 1 November , 2005 Share Posted 1 November , 2005 Dave, This may or may not be the correct answer, but I do have a list of all the National Registration Act Groupings for Male workers in 1915 and Group 12 was the "Manufacturers of Grease, Colouring Matter, etc". Now when looking at National Registration Act cards, and I have a few, the Grouping does tally with their occupation, in this case it appears to me not too, as under the N.R.A. Group 14, was "Wool & Worsted Manufacturers". Whether or not the Grouping was rearranged to take up those conscripted under the Military Services Act I couldn't say, but in all the Males had no less than 46 Occupational Groupings under the N.R.A. of 1915. There was also a seperate list for women. Graham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 1 November , 2005 Author Share Posted 1 November , 2005 Dave, This may or may not be the correct answer, but I do have a list of all the National Registration Act Groupings for Male workers in 1915 and Group 12 was the "Manufacturers of Grease, Colouring Matter, etc". Now when looking at National Registration Act cards, and I have a few, the Grouping does tally with their occupation, in this case it appears to me not too, as under the N.R.A. Group 14, was "Wool & Worsted Manufacturers". Whether or not the Grouping was rearranged to take up those conscripted under the Military Services Act I couldn't say, but in all the Males had no less than 46 Occupational Groupings under the N.R.A. of 1915. There was also a seperate list for women. Graham. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks Graham. It looks like there possibly was a change (or a mistake in the paybook) as he was a weaver in a cotton mill. Is the "code number" anything significant to these groupings do you think? Cheers, Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sanela Posted 1 November , 2005 Share Posted 1 November , 2005 (edited) http://boreokoociju.blogger.ba/ Sarajevo 1992-1995 I'm not convinced that this link was pasted in the right place - but I wouldn't know where else to move it! Edited 4 November , 2005 by Chris_Baker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Sweeney Posted 1 November , 2005 Share Posted 1 November , 2005 Dave, Your in luck. I'm not at home but have a saved copy of some research on Pay books for future publication. This is what I have: "In addition, General Routine Order 2831, 17 November 1917, required that the pay book be filled out in accordance with Army Orders 93, March 1917, as amended by Army Order 317, October 1917. The soldier was to record his civil occupation, by “Industrial Group” code, followed by the trade or calling in brackets, with the initial “S” or “M” indicating whether he was single or married at the top of the page. Any addition to the pay book was supposed to be witnessed and initialed by an officer." I have several pay books so anotated in handwriting. The industrial group is by AO 93 and amended by AO317. Industrial group 12 by AO 93 is: "Cotton" That is his occupation was a weaver of cotton textiles. IC 11 through 14 all had similar type descriptions depending on what type of material. Very confusing. What date is your Pay book? I don't recall any orders calling for a code through 1918? The 317 may reflect that the description in the paybook is governed by the amendments made by AO 317, which were extensive. However, this seems far too easy an explaination. I do not recall any of my wartime paybooks having a page like this (I'm going from a faulty memory). I have several post war ones I'll have to check when I get home. I should be released from duty in a week or two and will check my volumes of Army Orders for 1917 and 1918. Joe Sweeney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 1 November , 2005 Author Share Posted 1 November , 2005 What date is your Pay book? I don't recall any orders calling for a code through 1918?... ...I do not recall any of my wartime paybooks having a page like this (I'm going from a faulty memory). I have several post war ones I'll have to check when I get home. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks Joe. The paybook (which was issued to my wife's grandad who served July 1917 - August 1919) is dated August 1918, though several entries are backdated to August - October 1917. I only recieved this book today (after rummaging through a case-full of papers that belonged to my wife's recently deceased uncle) and I realised that it is yet another variation of the AB64 that I hadn't encountered previously (now upto about 13 different variations for 1914-18!). I thought it may have been a later edition, but it also differs subtly (and not so subtly, depending on the issue) from those that I have encountered also. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 1 November , 2005 Author Share Posted 1 November , 2005 http://boreokoociju.blogger.ba/ Sarajevo 1992-1995 <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks for that Sanela, but I don't quite see how that answers my question. (Got a few "nice" photos of my own from when I was over there in '92, but I doubt whether I'd get away with posting them on this forum! ) Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AB64 Posted 2 November , 2005 Share Posted 2 November , 2005 Just thought I would throw in a few more codes Machine hand group 12B, code blank - 8/18 printed book Carman (?) group 33, code 192 - 8/18 printed book House painter group 1887, code blank - 1/20 printed book Railway Clerk group 31, code 178 - 8/18 printed books Press hand group 26, code 14 - 8/18 printed book Railwayman group 31, code blank - 8/18 printed book labouror group 25, code 39 - 8/18 printed book fishmonger group 37 printed ? handwritten entry knife grinder group 40, code blank - book printed 8/18 electritian & fitter group 26, code 51 - book printed 8/18 painter group 30, code 12 - book printed 8/18 labouror group 1 code 213 printed ? handwritten entry clerk railway group 31 code 178 - book printed 8/18 The only real summary I can draw is that a lot of books were printed in 8/18 Alistair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Sweeney Posted 3 November , 2005 Share Posted 3 November , 2005 Just thought I would throw in a few more codes Machine hand group 12B, code blank - 8/18 printed book Carman (?) group 33, code 192 - 8/18 printed book House painter group 1887, code blank - 1/20 printed book Railway Clerk group 31, code 178 - 8/18 printed books Press hand group 26, code 14 - 8/18 printed book Railwayman group 31, code blank - 8/18 printed book labouror group 25, code 39 - 8/18 printed book fishmonger group 37 printed ? handwritten entry knife grinder group 40, code blank - book printed 8/18 electritian & fitter group 26, code 51 - book printed 8/18 painter group 30, code 12 - book printed 8/18 labouror group 1 code 213 printed ? handwritten entry clerk railway group 31 code 178 - book printed 8/18 The only real summary I can draw is that a lot of books were printed in 8/18 Alistair <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Interesting print date. Now I want to get home to check the dates on my books. I bet I don't have a single paybook in the 8/18 printing. Joe Sweeney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AB64 Posted 3 November , 2005 Share Posted 3 November , 2005 I think one was from a printer M & C or something like that and all the others B & C (will check this evening), so from the same print run. These paybooks are the short wide ones - they were to hand and easy to check as they are seperate as they dont fit in my files, my other paybooks are in folders so would take more work to trawl through. Alistair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 3 November , 2005 Author Share Posted 3 November , 2005 I think one was from a printer M & C or something like that and all the others B & C (will check this evening), so from the same print run. These paybooks are the short wide ones - they were to hand and easy to check as they are seperate as they dont fit in my files, my other paybooks are in folders so would take more work to trawl through. Alistair <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The one scanned in my posts was printed by "D & S", if it's any help. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AB64 Posted 3 November , 2005 Share Posted 3 November , 2005 Forgot I was going to check that - yes its D&S on all but one of those I checked (no idea where the idea of B&C came from) Alistair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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