16th Btn Kings Royal Rifle Corps

[rap1943]

Although I have mentioned these two documents in other posts in other parts of the forum it occured to me that this is where the info should be. I have the full War Diary electronically and a paper copy of the Chronicle.

Willing to do look ups

Bob

[Myrtle]

Bob

Please let me know if you have any information regarding the pows of this battalion. Rifleman Allen Edward Green A/932 "D" Coy 16th Bn. Kings Royal Rifle Corps died while a prisoner of war 21st April 1918 and was buried at Dendermonde Communal Cemetery.

Just to confuse matters SDGW has the same soldier listed as Albert Edward Green DoW 13th April 1918.

The name Allen is the more than likely the correct one as this appears on his local memorial and the CWGC database.

Myrtle

[rap1943]

Bob

Please let me know if you have any information regarding the pows of this battalion. Rifleman Allen Edward Green A/932 "D" Coy 16th Bn. Kings Royal Rifle Corps died while a prisoner of war 21st April 1918 and was buried at Dendermonde Communal Cemetery.

Just to confuse matters SDGW has the same soldier listed as Albert Edward Green DoW 13th April 1918.

The name Allen is the more than likely the correct one as this appears on his local memorial and the CWGC database.

Myrtle

Myrtle

Could you send me a PM with your email address please so I can forward the appropriate section of the diary. Thried to send you a PM but got told that your inbox is full or you have it disabled.

In the meantime I will have a look and see if I can find anything.

Cheers

Bob

[Myrtle]

Bob

Thank you for posting. I have sent you a pm and also cleared some messages from my inbox.

Myrtle

[johnreed]

Bob

I am interested in 12 October 1918 when A/200268 Rfn A E Gains was KIA.

Regards

John

[rap1943]

Hi John, could you send me a PM with your email address please then I will attach and send the appropriate section.

Cheers

Bob

[snailybailey]

Bob,

Any info on Rifleman C/1281 James Arncliffe Burdon 16th Bttn. KRRC, KIA 15th July 1916 aged 17. Also what is the 'Chronicle' excuse my ignorance!

Cheers

Glyn

[rap1943]

Bob,

Any info on Rifleman C/1281 James Arncliffe Burdon 16th Bttn. KRRC, KIA 15th July 1916 aged 17. Also what is the 'Chronicle' excuse my ignorance!

Cheers

Glyn

Hi Glyn

The section of the War Diary that covers the attack on High Wood on 15th July 1916 is transcribed on the sister site 'The Long Long Trail' linked at the top of the page. Rarely were other ranks mentioned by name and this is the case here.

The 'Chronicle' is a summary of the War Diary printed and published after the war. Some may say it was a fairly sanitised version of what occured. The only mention of OR is in the gallantry awards otherwise only killed and wounded officers get a mention in the 1916 chapter.

If you want a copy of the relevant sections of the War Diary just send me a PM with an email address.

Bob

[snailybailey]

Hi Glyn

The section of the War Diary that covers the attack on High Wood on 15th July 1916 is transcribed on the sister site 'The Long Long Trail' linked at the top of the page. Rarely were other ranks mentioned by name and this is the case here.

The 'Chronicle' is a summary of the War Diary printed and published after the war. Some may say it was a fairly sanitised version of what occured. The only mention of OR is in the gallantry awards otherwise only killed and wounded officers get a mention in the 1916 chapter.

If you want a copy of the relevant sections of the War Diary just send me a PM with an email address.

Bob

Bob, I have PM'd you but not sure if it has worked. I would be grateful for any War Diary info for James Arncliffe Burdon 16th Bttn KRRC KIA 15th July 1916...a few days either side of the 15th would be good but as much as you can send!!

Thanks very much

Glyn

[Audax]

For those interested in the attack on HIGH WOOD by 16/KRRC you may find it useful to have a look at the War Diary for 9/HLI of 100th Bde, 33rd Division - the full diary is available on line at:

http://www.rhf.org.uk/Books/9HLI%20War%20D...914%201919).doc

From 'Courage Past' by Alex Aitken p 68.

"The K.R.R. came up and assured us that they would clear the wood, but it was not long before they came tearing out of it and away from it. One of their officers threatened to shoot us if we moved from our positions, while his own men ran away. Later they were brought back".

4308 Pte Martin, L.V. (late 9th (Glasgow Highland) Battalion, The Highland Light Infantry)

[MBrockway]

Bob,

I'm researching my grandfather, John Brockway R/6479. Here's his entry in the British War & Victory Medals Roll (thanks due to 'shinglma'):

You'll see he was posted into the 12th Btn, but transferred into the 16 (CLB) Btn at some later point, before being demobbed as an Acting Corporal into Class Z Army Reserve on 2nd Mar 1919.

Obviously until I know when he transferred, it's very difficult to track his whereabouts.

My guess is this might be after the general re-organisation in the summer of 1918, or possibly after the Armistice when the 12th Battalion was disbanded relatively quickly. The 1919 Chronicle mentions drafts of 12/KRRC men to other battalions then, and the 16th was being lined up as part of the Occupation Force to monitor the elections in Schleswig-Holstein later in the year - though this came to nothing in the end and the 16th was disbanded over the summer I think.

That said, he was also wounded and sent back to Blighty several times, so he could equally well have been transferred on his return to duty after one of those episodes.

I'd be very grateful if you could do a look up in your copy of the 16/KRRC War Diary to see if he crops up anywhere. I don't suppose the War Diary is likely to record promotions to Corporals?

I'm also interested in whether there are any Nominal Rolls for the Btn in the War Diary? From what I understand, in some War Diaries,from time to time, the names of all the men in the battalion are listed as Nominal Rolls. It would help me narrow down the date he changed unit, if I can say that he was not on a 16/KRRC Nominal Roll at such-and-such a date.

Since names of ORs are very rare in the KRRC War Diaries, this may be a better lead anyway!

I hope I've undertood Nominal Rolls correctly ! If not, I'm sure the GWF Pals will put me right

Many thanks for your help!

Cheers,

Mark

[rap1943]

Hi Mark

If I get a chance I will look over the weekend. If I don't get a chance it will have to wait until the following week as I'm working up the bush all next week.

Don't hold out much hope though as I have not come across any rolls for this battalion and OR are rarely mentioned. Will look though.

Cheers

Bob

[MBrockway]

Hi Mark

If I get a chance I will look over the weekend. If I don't get a chance it will have to wait until the following week as I'm working up the bush all next week.

Don't hold out much hope though as I have not come across any rolls for this battalion and OR are rarely mentioned. Will look though.

Cheers

Bob

Thanks Bob - there's no rush, I'm in this for the duration

You've seen the discussion on his Service Records elsewhere. If that does all come up blank, do you think there's any point me pursuing Service Records with the KRRC/RGJ Regimental Museum in Winchester? Is there any chance they kept back copies, or were all the documents centralised in London to await the Nazi firebomb in 1940

When you say bush, do you mean as in Rivington Pike, or as in Bendigo ??

Have a good weekend!

Cheers,

Mark

[rap1943]

Hi Mark

Had a look through all 1918 and 1919 with no luck. The only OR mentioned are those who received awards and the odd KIA depending on circumstances. Likewise with the transferring in of new troops - no mention of the 12th Battalion. There was however two substantial drafts, 21st April at OCHTEZEELE 7 Officers & 284 OR and 7th May at WATTOU AREA 17 Officers & 156 OR. They were the only two drafts of any size although there were many noted in single numbers.

I also looked in the Chronicle with the same result I'm afraid.

Sorry I have not been of more help.

With regard to service records possibly held at Winchester - well I went through this whole business a few years ago while looking for my fathers records (still haven't got them) and they say they do not keep any. However I always believe 'if you don't ask you don't get'.

Bush as it applied to me last week was Hopetoun, Horsham and Dimboola all towns in the Wimmera/Mallee area of Victoria.

Cheers

Bob

[MBrockway]

Hi Mark

..

There was however two substantial drafts, 21st April at OCHTEZEELE 7 Officers & 284 OR and 7th May at WATTOU AREA 17 Officers & 156 OR. They were the only two drafts of any size although there were many noted in single numbers.

..

Cheers

Bob

Thanks anyway Bob.

I cross-checked the dates of those two large drafts against the 12th Battalion pages in the 1918 Chronicle and it looks like the 12th received drafts at about the same time too.

You'd think my GF would be more likely to be returned to his original Unit if both battalions were getting drafts, but I guess he may have been transferred as he was by then an Old Hand and they may have needed to spread that sort of experience around the battalions. He was an Acting Corporal when he was discharged in 1919, so by this time in 1918 he may have already been a L/Cpl.

Hope you had a good time up country.

Cheers,

Mark

[nicko576]

Bob

I have just picked up this thread, Two men i am researching, were in the 16KRRC, I am 95% certain they are brothers. William Ball was killed on the 15 July in the attack on High Wood, his name is listed on the Thiepval memorial, I have seen the war diaries on the Long long trail, for that attack, His brother however was Samuel Ball who died on the 24/3/1918, would it be possible that you have the War diary / chronicle for that time, also Samuel was awarded the MM, how can i find out how he was awarded it.

Many thanks

Nick

[Greenwoodman]

Bob

Could you tell me if there are entries in the Chronicle for the 7th, 16th, 17th and 20th battalions for the month of April 1918, the Battle of the Lys, please?

[rap1943]

Nick

Just came across your post here, I've posted a reply on your other current thread about sending me a PM.

Greenwoodman

I have the War Diary for the 16th electronically and the Chronicle for the 16th in hard copy. The Chronicle is essentially just a summary of the diary written after the war. If you send me a PM with your e-mail I will gladly send you the relevant entries.

Cheers

Bob

[Greenwoodman]

Bob

Many thanks for your offer. I have the war diary for the 16th for April 1918, but would much appreciate a look at the Chronicle entry. I'll PM you.

[Guest diyer]

Nick

Just came across your post here, I've posted a reply on your other current thread about sending me a PM.

Greenwoodman

I have the War Diary for the 16th electronically and the Chronicle for the 16th in hard copy. The Chronicle is essentially just a summary of the diary written after the war. If you send me a PM with your e-mail I will gladly send you the relevant entries.

Cheers

Bob

Bob,

I am interested in any mention of sgt Alf Steeley 16th btn KRRC KIA 23/4/1917. much appreciated.

Regards

Simon

[rap1943]

Hi Simon

Sorry I missed your post in Sept I've been otherwise engaged with a few personal issues. If you are out there still send me a PM with your email address and I'll send you the sections around when your man died.

Cheers

Bob