Helmmacher Abteilung

[joerookery]

Having chased the pickelhaube for some time, I thought I understood how they came into units. However, recently I found some pictures, which set me back on my heels. I had never heard of a Helmmacher Abteilung. I've done some digging and wrote a few paragraphs on what I thought to be the case. I would value anyone's opinion or insight on this. I'm sure, I only have it partially right. Thank you immensely in advance.

http://www.coljs.com/articles/BKa.htm

VR/Joe

[chris.wight]

Joe, perhaps Forum members Ralph J. Whitehead or Jack Sheldon could help out.

[cheetham42052]

The translation is

helmet maker department.

does that help?

[Jack Sheldon]

Joe

I have been thinking about this ever since I saw your original post. I have never heard of a helmet making detachment, but there is absolutely no reason why they could not have existed on a fairly large scale. All armies and the Imperial German Army in particular was far more self-sufficient for craftsmen and tradesmen than is the case today, where forward supply of stores, rations etc is easier to arrange. The Reserve XIV Corps, for example, on the Somme ran a slaughterhouse and there were divisonal mineral water bottling plants, butchery departments, sausage making units, bakeries etc, not to mention charcoal burners,cobblers, foundrymen etc - and all members of the Corps itself.

Ob.[er] meister has got nothing to do with headmasters I am sure. I think that there may have been an element of humour intended. It is quite common to see chalkboards used in this way on group photographs. A time-served apprentice in Germany had to complete his craft or trade training by making a Meisterstueck literally a 'Masterpiece'] This project had to be completed to perfection and demonstrate total mastery of the materials and tools of the trade. If it was deemed to be up to standard by the guild or trade the maker was accepted as a 'Meister', i.e. a master craftsmen. I suspect that the helmet makers jokingly referred to themselves as Helmmeister or something similar and that, therefore, the officer in charge, whatever rank he was he was, was declared on the board to be the Obermeister or 'Senior Master'.

B the way for anyone who has not yet visited Joe's website www.coljs.com, I recommend that you do; it is first class.

Jack

[egbert]

Obermeister is usually the head of guild; most guilds have so called Obermeister who stands ranking above the Meister=master craftman;

in this case an Obermeister might be drfted/volunteered into service and due to his abilities became head of a Helmmacher Abt.

[joerookery]

Jack,

Thanks for the undeserved complement on the web site. It is a monument to voice guided software. -- -- misspellings and all. I wonder if anybody besides 14th Corps had one of these organizations? Why would they put together helmets with both Prussian and Baden wappen?

On another note, Jack, I still don't have your book. I made the mistake of waiting for the American edition to be released 28 October. I am finding that patience is not my strong point.

Thank you everyone for all of your help. I need to make some changes to the article.

[Jack Sheldon]

Joe

I'll need to think on and perhaps talk to some experts. There will be a bit of a delay, because I am leaving in about seven hours for a week in Gallipoli. I'll get back to you on this on my return.

Jack

[AOK4]

It is probably a picture of the men from the Bekleidungsamt of the XIV. Armeekorps, who are posing for a photo and have given themselves this name. In the Bekleidungsamt, all kinds of uniform pieces and equipment were issued or repaired and reissued to the troops, probably some equipment from other corps got collected by Baden troops and sent to the BA for repair.

Jan