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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Apple green helmets


bkristof
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Hi,

i made these after seeing an original 1st july helmet.

A collector showed me his helmet with written on "souvenir vom dem sommeslach 1916" (or something like it).

The most strange thing to me was not the green, but the black cammoflage.

Are my restored living history helmets ok?

post-2572-1126119276.jpg

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Kristof,

I've never seen a British helmet camouflaged like this. But it does not seem out of the realm of possibility.

Its difficult to compare colors, but the original I have with remaining apple green is close.

Joe Swenney

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ok thank you very much!!!

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Kristof, what type or brand of paint did you use? or even a color number? Restoring one here as well.

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Revell paint.

i will check the number.

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Here is a photo of one with the early apple green finish:

dgh1561.jpg

looks simular indeed

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The colour:

Revell Colour SM 360

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Here is a photo of one with the early apple green finish:

dgh1561.jpg

Hello John,

Would it be possible to post a photo of the interior and liner of this

helmet. All information on WW1 Brodies is most gratefuly received.

Many thanks, Malc.

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Malc, Here are pics of early brodie liners:

this is the interior of the one pictured above:

liner1.jpg

and another:

liner2.jpg

and a third:

liner3.jpg

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Hello John,

Thanks for the photos, very nice helmets.

I notice that #1 has an embossed pattern on the strap

is this rare, was it common to one particular liner

manufacturer?

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Hello John,

Thanks for the photos, very nice helmets.

I notice that #1 has an embossed pattern on the strap

is this rare, was it common to one particular liner

manufacturer?

Sorry, I dont know the answer to that one. That particular helmet is no longer in my possession - all I have are the photos.

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Malc,

I've tried to take some photos (not the best) of a helmet that was once painted light blue/grey "duck egg".

On the exterior you can see a large chip from the overpaint and the grey underneath.

The interior shows a bit of grey but also the sloppily applied green overpaint. Note the dripping down the dome. The surface under the liner is heavily coated with dust but has the original grey finish.

The Helmet is also magnetic which puts manufacture in the first batches of helmets produced in 1915.

Joe Sweeney

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Malc,

I've tried to take some photos (not the best) of a helmet that was once painted light blue/grey "duck egg".

On the exterior you can see a large chip from the overpaint and the grey underneath.

The interior shows a bit of grey but also the sloppily applied green overpaint. Note the dripping down the dome.  The surface under the liner is heavily coated with dust but has the original grey finish.

The Helmet is also magnetic which puts manufacture in the first batches of helmets produced in 1915.

Joe Sweeney

Hello Joe,

This one is also magnetic, but it has a rim, no doughnut ring,and I think it is a

Patent pending liner. I would guess this one to be early 1916, what do you think?

It's marked MLS 33

All the best, Malc.post-7246-1126763582.jpgpost-7246-1126763762.jpg

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malc,

Technically, it's not supposed to be magnetic--if it is a MkI helmet.

Supposedly only the first batches made in 1915 were magnetic. That is about 10000 to 25000 helmets-can't remember the actual number. Then all helmet metal was to be non magnetic.

How is the rim on your helmet, it looks like it might be a bit crude?

I ask because I have another magnetic helmet that is odd and seen a depot mod.

It still has its original Apple green paint. First pattern liner--MKI type chinstrap and has had a rim crudely attached. You can see that it was put on by a man using a pair of crimpers.

I've posted pictures of this helmet before and they may still be on the forum, but it appears many photos were lost in a SW upgrade a few months ago. I'm not home so can't post a photo.

Your helmet may have used an old shell in manufacture. I would say that it would date anywhere from no earlier tha the summer of 1916 through the summer of 1917. If I remember correctly the instructions to add the rubber ring was to be added in April 1917 so given an over lap.

Joe Sweeney

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malc,

Technically, it's not supposed to be magnetic--if it is a MkI helmet.

Supposedly only the first batches made in 1915 were magnetic. That is about 10000 to 25000 helmets-can't remember the actual number. Then all helmet metal was to be non magnetic.

How is the rim on your helmet, it looks like it might be a bit crude?

I ask because I have another magnetic helmet that is odd and seen a depot mod.

It still has its original Apple green paint. First pattern liner--MKI type chinstrap and has had a rim crudely attached. You can see that it was put on by a man using a pair of crimpers.

I've posted pictures of this helmet before and they may still be on the forum, but it appears many photos were lost in a SW upgrade a few months ago. I'm not home so can't post a photo.

Your helmet may have used an old shell in manufacture. I would say that it would date anywhere from no earlier tha the summer of 1916 through the summer of 1917. If I remember correctly the instructions to add the rubber ring was to be added in April 1917 so given an over lap.

Joe Sweeney

Hello Joe,

The rim is about the same as all my other MK1s

I only decided to check them with a magnet after reading

your comment earlier, I must say it came as a bit of a surprise to me.

As you say, it may be a re-issue modification or I suppose there must have been

a transitional period when they may have used the shells that were already made.

It has been repainted, but the interior looks like the original manufacturers colour.

Regards Malc.

PS I am awaiting the delivery of a Type A rimless helmet that I suspect may

be original duckegg blue, that has been overpainted.

I will keep you posted.

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Hello Joe,

The rim is about the same as all my other MK1s 

I only decided to check them with a magnet after reading

your comment earlier, I must say it came as a bit of a surprise to me.

As you say, it may be a re-issue modification or I suppose there must have been

a transitional period when they may have used the shells that were already made.

It has been repainted, but the interior looks like the original manufacturers colour.

Regards Malc.

PS  I am awaiting the delivery of a Type A rimless helmet that I suspect may

be original duckegg blue, that has been overpainted.

I will keep you posted.

Using a magnet will only prove its made of steel... if the helmet is magnetic, a small nail will stick to it... ;)

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Using a magnet will only prove its made of steel... if the helmet is magnetic, a small nail will stick to it... ;)

John,

Actually, this is not the case. Steel can be and is commonly produced that does not have magnetic properties i.e. a magnetic will not be attracted to it. It does not mean a nail will or will not stick to it.

Malc,

It's interesting that your shell is magnetic. The steel used in the rim is sometimes magnetic, it shouldn't be either but is commonly found to be magnetic, any chance your placing the magnet close to the rim?

Joe Sweeney

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John,

Actually, this is not the case. Steel can be and is commonly produced that does not have magnetic properties i.e. a magnetic will not be attracted to it. It does not mean a nail will or will not stick to it.

Malc,

It's interesting that your shell is magnetic.  The steel used in the rim is sometimes magnetic, it shouldn't be either but is commonly found to be magnetic, any chance your placing the magnet close to the rim?

Joe Sweeney

You're right! I've just run a magnet across 8 helmets and it doesn't stick to any of them (except the rim).

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John,

Actually, this is not the case. Steel can be and is commonly produced that does not have magnetic properties i.e. a magnetic will not be attracted to it. It does not mean a nail will or will not stick to it.

Malc,

It's interesting that your shell is magnetic.  The steel used in the rim is sometimes magnetic, it shouldn't be either but is commonly found to be magnetic, any chance your placing the magnet close to the rim?

Joe Sweeney

Joe and John,

I was assuming that the term 'magnetic' was used to describe mild steel helmets

to which a magnet will pull, attract , or stick, as opposed to the Manganese ones

which magnets are not attracted to.

Roger V Lucy states in his book that only the first 4,440 helmets produced were

made in mild steel. My magnet sticks to this helmet, but does not stick to any other MK1 in my collection.

Regards Malc.

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I wonder if this is the kind of helmet my uncle was wearing. This is an extract from his diary:

April 26, 1918 – Ready for breakfast when a H.V. [high velocity shell] got a direct hit on our house. Buried 6 men but no one hurt. Officers were all covered by dust and glass. Left here & went to funk holes in a field. I stopped a big piece with my tin hat. Very cold in the holes & nothing to eat but bully beef & tea. Left late in the p.m. for a new position. Much quieter. Good dinner & good sleep.

He was in Belgium near Reningelst when this was written.

Ann

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Malc,

I'm home and I know where I got the 25000 from. That was the original order put in by the MoM for the mild steel helmets. Production stopped at 4400 and the remaining 20600 helmets were made from the hardened steel.

Roger Lucy's book is very good but if you want specific detail then get a hold of Marcus Cottons articles from Militaria Magazine. They are far more detailed and a lot if not all of the info Roger Lucy has in his book minus specific Candian Corps reference came Marcus Cottons articles. Marcus's articles are in French and English. The Frecnch articles have better (more Color) photos. These articles have a lot of the info you seek on helmet colors and Helmet covers.

Also I looked up the rubber ring. It was introduced on a limited scale in Feb 1917, put in trails in March, with full scale production in June 1917.

Ann,

Almost postively this is the type helmet that your uncle was wearing. "Tin Hat" was slang for these helmets

Joe Sweeney

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Do you know where I can get the Marcus Cotton magazine articles,

Does anybody have a spare copy, or could they scan me a copy?

Regards Malc.

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