Canterbury Pals (East Kent Reg)

[Grey Squirrel]

Dear All

I have seen a mention of the Canterbury Pals in Gordon Corrigan's "Mud, Blood & Poppycock" which I'm reading at present. Two tables in the book refer to Canterbury Pals (East Kent Reg) suffering 40% casualties (747 out of 1,882 were killed). Does anyone know which particular battalion was the Canterbury Pals, or can anyone suggest how I might find out? Thanks.

Apologies if this is a really elementary question... I have little experience of WW1 research.

Stephen

[CROONAERT]

Does anyone know which particular battalion was the Canterbury Pals,

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

To be honest, I can't say I've ever heard of this term before and can't find any official listing of this term being used to describe any particular battalion of the Buffs.

However, just like the unnofficially titled "Bournemouth Pals", "Burnley Pals" and the "Preston Pals" (none of which (apart from the Burnley Pals, who were a part of a "pals" battalion) were actually officially recognised "Pals" units), I suppose the Canterbury Pals could have been a company within a battalion rather than the whole battalion.

The East Kent's service battalions that were raised in Canterbury were the 6th, 7th and 8th Battalions. Chances are that the "Canterbury Pals" were a part of one of these (probably the 6th).

Dave.

[Hambo]

Stephen

First of all welcome to the forum!

I concur with Dave, the pals battalions seem to be more of a northern thing although plenty of "pals" joined up together elsewhere in the country. Many units and companies carried local names to give them a local identity and encourage local pride to help recruiting

I'd be interested in what the table refers to. According to "Soldiers Died in the Great War" the Buffs dead were as follows

6th Battalion 1,350

7th Battalion 1,062

8th Battalion 585

As Dave said these battalions were all raised in Canterbury and were all New Army or "Service" Battalions ie the men signed on for the duration. Any or all of them could have been known as Pals.

Hambo

[Clive Maier]

I suspect that Canterbury Pals is a descriptive term applied retrospectively by Corrigan. If the name was contemporaneous you should be able to find mention of it in Historical Records of the Buffs East Kent Regiment 1914-1919, Moody, Medici Society, 1922. The book has been reprinted by the Naval & Military Press.

[Grey Squirrel]

I suspect that Canterbury Pals is a descriptive term applied retrospectively by Corrigan. It the name was contemporaneous you should be able to find mention of it in Historical Records of the Buffs East Kent Regiment 1914-1919, Moody, Medici Society, 1922. The book has been reprinted by the Naval & Military Press.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks for the very prompt replies, everyone...

I must apologise, I actually mis-quoted Gordon Corrigan... he doesn't actually write "Canterbury Pals". What he does in a 3 or 4 page section on the various Pals battalions is refer to the Bradford, Leeds and Durham Pals and then has a table showing the numbers/percentages in these 3 battalions plus those in Barnsley, Liverpool and Canterbury. I inferred that the Barnsley, Liverpool and Canterbury battalions were also "Pals" and, re-reading the text, the author is implying that these places suffered a similar percentage of losses. However, that is not the same as saying they were actually known as "Pals".

The statistics Corrigan quotes for Canterbury are as follows:

1,882 other ranks killed who were born or who enlisted in Canterbury

of whom 747 killed in local regiment (East Kent Reg)

=40% in local regiment

[Clive Maier]

It is oddly satisfying to find the thing we had not heard of doesn’t exist! Grim figures though.

[Grey Squirrel]

It is oddly satisfying to find the thing we had not heard of doesn’t exist! Grim figures though.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Indeed.

FYI, what I am actually doing is researching the men remembered on the Whitstable War Memorial and in a separate WW1 memorial in the local church dedicated to members of its congregation who were killed in action. I have been surprised how few of the soldiers appear to have served in what I would have thought would have been their local regiment, The Buffs.

Incidentally, what course of action is recommended if one finds a man recorded on a local memorial as having been killed, but who does not appear on the CWGC website?

Thanks again.

Stephen

[CROONAERT]

Incidentally, what course of action is recommended if one finds a man recorded on a local memorial as having been killed, but who does not appear on the CWGC website?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

First of all make sure (with evidence) that he actually was killed (or died within the CWGC criteria). If he died after he had been discharged from the services (even if he died of a war related reason), then he doesn't qualify for inclusion by the CWGC. Similarly, if he died after their "cut-off" date (June(?) 1921) then again, he doesn't qualify.

If you can get the (compelling) evidence together to prove that he died within the set criteria, then next step is to contact the CWGC and tell them what you have. They'll let you know the next steps.

War memorials have no hard and fast rules about who gets included, but the CWGC does. (One war memorial near me lists the name of an ex-soldier who died of a heart attack in a taxi in the 1950's - he's not on the CWGC lists either!!! )

Dave.

[Michael]

I've arrived a bit late on this one. Firstly, as you have correctly deduced there were no Buffs "pals" battalions although I'm currently looking at a company which appears to be made up of men from one institution.

Gordon's figures are based on SDGW so cannot be taken as evidence of the total amount of men from Canterbury. This is because there are too many errors and blank data.

If you want any more info on men of the Buffs please don't hesitate to contact me

Mick

PS welcome to the list of people who've found at least one mystery name on their memorial!

[Grey Squirrel]

Thanks again, everyone, for your input and helpful advice. This is a great forum: wonderful to find everyone not just so knowledgeable but also so willing to share and assist one another.

I may well take up the kind offer from you, Mick, re the Buffs but first I ought to read the re-printed "Historical Records of..." which I have seen in a local book shop.

Thanks, Dave, for the advice on war memorial v CWGC discrepancies... I think I have one but I need to do more in-depth research to be sure that the soldier in question was indeed a casualty of the war in the terms laid down by CWGC.

Stephen