Bob Coulson Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Feel sure this has been asked before but can't put my finger on it. Could someone confirm the criteria as to how local cemeteries in the UK qualify for a Cross of Sacrifice.? Bob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenwoodman Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 A very quick scan through "Courage Remembered" indicates a minimum of 40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 The number of burials is usually taken as 40 although you will find a few exceptions with less. Sometimes a Cross of Sacrifice is erected in one cemetery and it also 'covers' another nearby cemetery. That is CWGC's policy but some local authorities have erected their own Crosses sculpted in a very similiar style in their cemeteries which may or may not have otherwise qualified. The number of burials required for the larger (and more expensive) Stone of Remembrance is about 400 - again sometimes varied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenwoodman Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Although Sailly wasn't one of my 'target' cemeteries on this year's holiday, we stopped for a water break there anyway. Sailly Australian and Sailly Canadian are across the road from each other, both well above minumum size for the Cross. If my memory serves me right (not my strong point these days) the Cross is in one and the Stone in the other - nice touch. Yeh, looked out the photos. The Cross in the Australian cemetery is close to the gate (and the road), the two gates are opposite each other, and the Canadian cemetery has an avenue of grass leading from the gate to the stone. Cross, gates and stone are all in line (as I remember). One cross and one stone covering two cemeteries. Sailly Australian below taken from alongside the cross. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenwoodman Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Sailly Canadian taken from the Australian Cemetery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Yes, the 'one for two' policy can also be found overseas where two cemeteries are very close. The original query was about the UK and, interstingly, there are a small number of UK cemeteries with two Crosses - ie Brookwood Military Cemetery, Surrey and Brighton (Bear Road), Sussex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul guthrie Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Terry I remember that about Brookwood, was it one cross in WW1 section and another in WW2? They have US between them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Yes Paul One is in the main WW1 section and the other is at the top of the WW2 Canadian plot. The WW2 one also appears on my Avatar! When two appear in a cemetery, it is usually because there are large plots from both wars some distance apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul guthrie Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 There are an amazing # of Canadians from both wars there out of proportion to their #s in British forces. I forget what I have been told about Canadian hospitals nearby, must have been if my statement is correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Paul The Canadians make up 53% of the Commonwealth burials at Brookwood Military Cemetery - 326 (WW1) and 2405 (WW2) = 2731 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Picking up on the 'two for one' stuff. The two cemeteries at Couin face each other across the road, and each has a Cross. The architects design placed both of the crosses near the road, giving symmetry almost like a reflection in a mirror. Wonderful, especially when you think of budgetary constraints. The two cemeteries at Dikkebus also face each other - I can't recall if there are two Crosses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 Dickebusch Old Military Cemetery has a Cross. Dickebusch New Military Cemetery has a Stone of Remembrance with a Cross in its Extension across the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Coulson Posted 16 July , 2003 Author Share Posted 16 July , 2003 All, Many thanks for the info and replies. 40 would be about right, my local cemetery contains 54 WW1 CWGC headstones and has a fine Cross of Sacrifice just inside the main gate yet away from the burial plots. Just as an add on is it usual in the UK for the cross to be away from the graves.? Bob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 16 July , 2003 Share Posted 16 July , 2003 The position of the Cross varies but is usually near the greatest concentration of war graves. In many cemeteries the graves are scattered rather than being in one plot and then a central location is usually used. It also depended on what ground the cemetery owner (local authority, church or private company) would donate for this purpose - ground in a cemetery is often valuable. Remember that in UK cemeteries many of the war graves will have private memorials making it possible for a cemetery with less than 40 CWGC headstones to have a Cross. It is the total number of war graves - not CWGC headstones - that counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Coulson Posted 17 July , 2003 Author Share Posted 17 July , 2003 Terry, Thanks for the explanation. Bob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinglma Posted 18 July , 2003 Share Posted 18 July , 2003 Where there is a cross of sacrifice in a local cemetery is it maintained by the CWGC? The reason I ask is that on my last visit (three weeks ago) the cross of sacrifice in Acklam Road Cemetery, Middlesbrough was badly covered in graffiti. Who should one take this up with? I was going to wait until my next visit in a couple of weeks time when I will be armed with a camera. Mike S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Coulson Posted 19 July , 2003 Author Share Posted 19 July , 2003 Mike, Terry will I am sure answer your query re maintaining the Cross of Sacrifice. As an aside, not far from Acklam, my local cemetery at Eston contains the private memorial to our local VC, William Short. It was originally situated in the square at Grangetown and was moved to the cemetery in the 20's or 30's I think. It is situated close to my family graves so I always visit while I am there. A couple of years ago it got into quite a state with graffiti which after a few letters by concerned people was cleaned up very nicely by the local council. This is though as I mentioned earlier a private memorial "subscribed to by the officers and men". However on this occasion full marks to the local council. Bob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt York Posted 20 July , 2003 Share Posted 20 July , 2003 With regard to graffiti. My hometown memorial on Merseyside has had to be enclosed in high railings and padlocked because of graffiti and vandalism. I'd love to be able to take the mindless creatures responsible back in time to spend just one day in the trenches with the 279 brave young lads whose names are inscribed on the memorial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 20 July , 2003 Share Posted 20 July , 2003 The maintenance of the crosses in local cemeteries is the responsibility of the cemetery owner. CWGC will look after those in their own cemeteries or plots for which they are responsible. If the cross was originally erected by CWGC they probably had an agreement with the cemetery owner for them to maintain the Cross. However, you must remember that many Crosses were actually erected by the community/local authority and are obviously still their responsibility. Contact the cemetery owner - usually the District, Town or Parish Council if it is in a cemetery rather than a churchyard or church cemetery. Although many 'closed' churchyards are also now the responsibility of the local authority even if the church itself is still in use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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