Guest Jodie Posted 4 June , 2005 Share Posted 4 June , 2005 Having learn't recently that my Great-Grandad was buried in a paupers grave in 1983, this fact prompts me to research him. He was a veteran of the great-war, and if family 'oral' history is to be believed signed up very young, and this fact mitigated in his 'escape' with the award of No.1 Field punishment whilst he was at risk of a far worse fate. (absent without leave?) All these memories of my Great-Grandad come from my grandmother who i have day to day contact. As I type she hopefully is writing down all she remembers of her father. This I asked her (she was only to pleased to oblige) to do. Also through my Nan she is contacting her sisters to find a service number, she thinks his pay book may still survive. His medals I believe are with another relative. Apparently his service in the R.E. was long, and included service as a driver for pretty senior officers. On retirement he maintained 'crown farm' an R.E. establishment on the A2 in Gillingham Kent. It just seemed to me that researching his history would be an appropriate gesture for such an initial 1983 'family' failing of my Great-Grandad. With this in mind steps have been made to purchase this 'grave'. So with the advice in 'Grandads war' my next homework (Far more interesting than my BA geography reading) Here I go on researching 'Frederick Richard Taylor'. Next day off me going to the R.E. museum to have a gander, then off to the N.A. when got service number. Let you know how i get on. Jodie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilB Posted 4 June , 2005 Share Posted 4 June , 2005 Good luck! Phil B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris.wight Posted 4 June , 2005 Share Posted 4 June , 2005 Best of luck, Jodie! I look forward to reading more from you and let us know if we can help with any questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marina Posted 4 June , 2005 Share Posted 4 June , 2005 It will be really interesting to see a research project in progress - tell all you do to help novices like me - and good luck with it all! Marina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stiletto_33853 Posted 4 June , 2005 Share Posted 4 June , 2005 Jodie, The very best of luck, keep us informed as you go along. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Saunders Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 Jodie, I always understood paupers graves were multiple burial plots. I am happy to be proved wrong but if I am right you will not be able to purchase it. Also I know some of the pauper graves in Woodlands Rd are on the bottom left hand side as you enter through the gates. If you look I think this area is mostly devoid of headstones and is just grassed over. You have probably already been in contact with Medway Council and they should be able to help you with the site of the exact plot. The RE museum is very interesting ... fantastic medal collection. Enjoy your new interest! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Nelson Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 Jodie, This type of work is extremely rewarding. I have nearly completed researching, and writing the war service of my Great Grandfather. It was fascinating, and now my family will have a written history. Something of great value for my children and indeed thier children when they come along. Good luck with your project and I hope you will find it as rewarding as I have. Cheers Aaron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jodie Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 (edited) Thanks for all the encouragement, this research is so addictive after only 2 days!!!!! Think my 84 year old nan a goldmine of info. So far from her. Name of his father, for next of kin details etc (for double checking purposes) My Great Grandads date of birth. (29/7/1898) The house where he lived as a boy. (She passes it on the Age Concern bus sometimes). Me now thinking census. Also wheres my camera. She thinks he enlisted at 16 (would make this 1914, apparently my mother who spoke to my great-grandad many years ago remembers him telling her he lied about his age) Nan thinks he was in 38th Field Co. R.E. during War. Today Nan is phoning her sister for all the info on his paybook. Also trying to locate his medals. (Both i hope will be found, to supply his number) Think i'm coming up against my first problem. Apparently he served in the R.E. til 1936. So are his papers still unreleased? Nan is not sure but he might have come out after the war, then gone back in later. According to Nan (slightly of topic). After the war served as a Generals driver, and on some occasions drove the Prince of wales. Also he was involved (as a civie?) in building those WW2 offshore forts visable from Herne Bay in kent. Also my great grandads mum was the daughter of the govener of the prison in chatham dockyard. Re. Grave purchase, this part of remembering Frederick Taylor my mother has got in hand. Apparently she has gathered up the cash from lots of the family, after being in contact with some lady from the council and when we last spoke she is waiting on the deeds. Yep jonathan you right re. communal graves (bit of a shock) Great Grandad is 1 of 3 people buried in that plot, with 1 space still remaining, this really motivated some of the family. Think next plan is to sort a permanent headstone. I personally like the style of the 'cwgc' that can be used (looking different from those headstones for those fallen in war). Will keep you informed, hopefully nan will come up trumps this afternoon. Jodie Edited 5 June , 2005 by Jodie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry_Reeves Posted 5 June , 2005 Share Posted 5 June , 2005 Jodie It looks like he may have a had a full career in the Army and as he served until 1938, his papers will not be available at the NA. However, it is possible for relatives to get copies of service records for men serving after 1920. You should contact the following for for further information: Army Personnel Centre Historical Disclosures Mail Point 400 Kentigern House 65 Brown St Glasgow G2 8EX You will need to include his service details ie, full name, service number (s) and date of birth. You will almost certainly require a letter of consent from his nearest legal relative to obtain these documents. Terry Reeves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jodie Posted 6 June , 2005 Share Posted 6 June , 2005 From my nans phone call to her sister re. my great-grandads paybook: 21/9/15 France. 2/2/16 Greece. Home Reserve 10/3/1919 - 16/12/20. Rejoined 17/3/21. Boxing course. 10/10/27. Medals, no info as of yet. (hopefully these will be forthcoming soon, family network being informed of research, 1 son of my great-grandad has been named as the holder) Also from this phone-call info is where Terry Reeves's (see post above) caveat comes in to play. On his paybook was a number 1853433. From a scan of the N/A medal index, no entry. I noticed that all R.E. entries of the similar name had 6 digits (or a letter then 6 digits) My great-grandads is 7 digits. I done a quick scan of the cwgc register, I noticed that R.E. K.I.A in the second world war had 7 digit numbers. So i am wondering if he was allocated a second number on re-enlisting in 1921.? I dont have the paybook in my possesion, I am wondering if I should see this book in person. A big thank-you to Terry for his trouble in posting the address of the Army Personnel Centre, writing to this centre a priority. I guess this again proves the power of this wonderful site, and its great members. Thank-you all. My next steps: Write to the Army personnel dept. (with my nans permission/consent) chase up his medals. Read this sites information on Greece (Salonika) does seem to tie up with his field co. (38th). Had absolutely no idea of this theatre existed. visit R.E. museum (and join the friends of the museum). I see a diary read is on the cards. consilidate my notes, already they coming a mish-mash. Take my nan for a cream tea at headcorn, then visit the aero-drome there, she likes watching the tiger moths go ballistic. What i have learnt about doing this research: Rather than giving a relative a blank sheet of paper, perhaps some gentle prompting face to face is more productive. This paid off with obtaining my great-grandads home address. As the family network is proving, relatives are a godsend. Oral history prompts questions, and documents still seem to survive. Talking to my nan also revealed that my distant relative is Bombadier Billy Wells, a boxer that used to bang the gong on the intro to rank films. My mother is phoning the authorities re. whats the latest on the grave purchase on monday. Will keep my diary up to date, ta for looking in. Jodie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jodie Posted 6 June , 2005 Share Posted 6 June , 2005 Was just on my way to bed, after having last ciggie then something popped into my head ! If my great-grandad re-entered in 1921, does this mean his papers were not potentially destroyed during the second world war? Were they stored somewhere else ? Oh so many questions ! Another aside, whilst searching for 'crown farm' i came across 'city ark' an archive run by medway council. although totally bemused by the results of my search !!!! there seemed to be lots of ww1 stuff, including photo's of serving soldiers etc. Might be worth a look. Jodie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchman Posted 6 June , 2005 Share Posted 6 June , 2005 Jodie My grandad served in WW1 South Staffordshires and then re enlisted in 1920 with Scots Guards. I have just sent a letter to the army personnel records to see if they have a copy of his WW1 records, as like you, I thought that they would have survied the WW2 bombing, because they would have been with Scots Guards. This thought being furthered by the PRO Kew who suggested writing a letter. I will let you know if I get any response. Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jodie Posted 6 June , 2005 Share Posted 6 June , 2005 Goodluck Watchman with your research, yep keep me informed ta ! Not much to write today, combination of essay preparation and work commitments severly ate into research time. Nan today at age concern, she did reveal though that great-grandad was in charge of some women building a road in greece. Again 'story' confirmed by my mother who was told this first hand by my great-grandfather. Jodie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Nelson Posted 7 June , 2005 Share Posted 7 June , 2005 Jodie, Keep the enthusiam up, its worth the effort in the end. I would definately recommend seeing the paybook in person, or simply get who ever has it to photocopy and post to you. With my Great Grandfather all I had to go on was a copy of the paybook, but it told me heaps, and just as well, because his service records were destroyed in WW2. One more point, a word of warning re family oral histories. This can send you astray sometimes. An example in my case, everyone thought the middle name of my Great Grandfather was Hinchcliffe, infact it was Hinchliffe without the C. I was searching through all sorts of records for Hinchcliffe, on a wild goose chase. So always try to get some official documentation eg Birth certififcate in my case, which confirms the family oral history. Keep us informed on how its going. best regards Aaron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchman Posted 16 June , 2005 Share Posted 16 June , 2005 Hi Jodie Just received a letter from the Army Personnel Office. They agreed that the records of men re enlisting after the great war were normally moved to the regiment they served with and therefore normally escaped the loss known as burnt records. However in the case of my grandad the Army personnel office do not hold any records of Footguards and I will have to contact Wellington Barracks. The address I wrote to was Army Personnel Office Civil Secretariat Historical Disclosures Mail point 400 Kentigern House 65 Brown Street Glasgow G2 8EX Hope this helps, good luck Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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