Sgt Thomas Willaim Page

[Patrick H]

One on my roll.

Sgt Thomas William Page 68887 Suffolk Regt died home 14.03.1921 aged 50.

King George's Coronation Medal, Long Service and GCM served previously 24 years in Essex Regt served in S Africa Campaign re-enlisted 1914

Can any Essex men out there tell me which Battalion of the Essex he served in?

Thanks

Patrick

[J T Gray]

Patrick,

Try emailing the curator at the Essex Regiment Museum

http://www.chelmsfordbc.gov.uk/museums/contact.htm

(note that's the web page for the contacts, not his email! Just one less mention for the spam harvesters to find).

He's always glad to help with anything Essex Regiment.

Failing that, wait for GrandsonMichael to spot this post - likewise, always happy to help with anything Essex Reg!

Adrian

[Patrick H]

Patrick,

Try emailing the curator at the Essex Regiment Museum

Adrian

Adrian,

took your advice and within 30 mins Ian replied with the following- brilliant and thanks

" regret that I am unable to find details of any previous service for Page. He does not even figure in the Medal Roll for the South African War Medals for the Regiment.

His number immediately prior to the transfer to the Suffolk Regiment was 3/1472, a 3rd Battalion number issued between 11/1911 and 01/1912.

According to the Published Regimental history he was the Senior NCO in the 3rd Battalion's Contingent at the 1911 Coronation.

Between 1881 and 1908 the 3rd (Militia) Battalion carried out (together with the 4th (Militia) Bn) the recruiting and training of Militia Recruits for the Regiment.

Recruits were enlisted for the Militia Battalions and did Basic Training at their Regimental Depots (in our case at Warley Barracks). having passed out they had two options. Either to go back to civilian life and be recalled each year of their engagement for one month's training, or to opt to become a Regular soldier.

It was very common for Regulars to come in via the Militia for two reasons. Firstly that it appealed to those who might fancy being a soldier but did not want to commit themsleves too irrevocably. Secondly, ad often the more iportant factor, the Recruiting Sergeants received a Bounty per head for recruits accepted. If they persuaded the likely lad to sign on as a Militiaman ("see if you like it...") they got a Bounty. If, subsequently, the happy Militiaman decided to go Regular, then the (now even happier) Recruiting Sergeant got a second Bounty! There was, therefore, every good reason to dissaude a potential Regular Recruit for committing on day one!

I am unable to state why he would have changed numbers in 1911 to a number series begun in 1908 when the 3rd(Militia) Bn became the 3rd (Special Reserve) Battalion. If Page had been serving at this time one would expect him to have been renumbered at this time. Perhaps, however he had a break of service before re-enlisting in the Special Reserve.

It is frustrating that his earlier service papers may well have been held with his 1914-18 war papers (even if he had no overseas service) and may well have been destroyed in the 1941 Blitz along with 70% of other such papers. The surviving 30% are held on microfiche at the National Archives at Kew.

Thus I am unable to say, even, whether he was a Militiaman throughout his service or a Regular who voluntarily opted for Militia service at the end of his time, or if he was a Regular who did an instructional job with the Permanent Staff of the 3rd (Milita) Bn prior to voluntary re-enlistment in 1911 and embodiment (i.e. being put on full time service) in 1914. The fact that he got a Long Service and Good Conduct Medal is, however, indicative of a long-serving Regular.

Unusually he appears to have fallen through the net despite his long service!

Wishing you well with your research,

Yours sincerely,

Ian Hook

Keeper of The Essex Regiment Museum

Oaklands Park

Moulsham St

Chelmsford

Essex

CM2 9AQ

UK

PS yes he did agree to me posting this

Patrick

[Patrick H]

And thats before GrandsonMichael got the chance !! But I would welcome any input he might have on Page.

I am really only posting this to make up my 100th post and see what rank that gives me, if any

[J T Gray]

He's good, isn't he? But what a ****** that he can't add any more!

Adrian

[Patrick H]

Well I am more than satisfied with that plus details from CWGC. I have over 60 names to research (plus other lines of research) and would get bogged down if I tried for too much !

He is buried in Lorne Road Cem, Warley and will try and get over there this weekend. On my last visit it was difficult to locate some of the graves

I havnt yet worked out how to upload digital photos

Patrick

[GrandsonMichael]

Drat! Patrick, I've searched and searched but cannot find any trace of your man.

I have narrowed down the Essex regiments he could have served in somewhat

Looking at the South African connection we're talking about the 1st, 2nd and 3rd Battalions, some men from the 1st, 2nd, 3rd & 4th Volunteer Bn.'s, 1 Section of the 4th Bn. Mounted Infantry. Helpful isn't it?

Naturally I fully agree with Ian Hook regarding the fact that he would seem to be a long time regular. There is one thing I wonder though, why did he (re)join the Suffolks?

Let’s do some arithmetic: born in 1870 or 1871? Can’t find his birth anywhere using Ancestrycom for England and Wales. Father a military man stationed abroad? Where were the 1st & 2nd Bn.s in 1870/71: either in Ireland or (underway to) India, both regiments mind.

Let's say he joined the Essex Regiment when he was 18 (that's when his service time for the LS & GC Medal would start to count) round about 1889. He doesn't show up in the 1891 Census either. The 1st Bn. was at home until January 1891, when it moved to Ireland. The 2nd Bn. was partly on Malta and partly on Cyprus from 1887 to 1892 and thereafter in India.

Part of the 2nd. Bn. was sent to South Africa in January 1900 ( a company of Mounted Infantry - on Burmese ponies!) The rest of the Bn. was sent over in March 1901.

I realise this is rather speculative, but I'd opt for him being a 1st or 2nd Bn. regular.....It would be interesting if someone who has access to the Ireland Census could confirm if he was or wasn't born there and of course this little theory depends on my own Census search being reliable.

Cheers,

Michael