Clergymen enlisting as combatants

[swizz]

Doing a bit of research today and came across one Irish Anglican minister who informed his Select Vestry of his intention to enlist as a 'combatant.' There's no indication, unfortunately, of whether he went ahead with it or not. I wondered if this often happened? Any others I've come across with war service either served as a Chaplain or else in the RAMC. I wondered whether anyone else had uncovered any similar cases?

Swizz

[Desmond7]

Something tells me I have a minister who served at first as a despatch rider before becoming a chaplain.

He then won the MC as a chaplain! Will check.

[swizz]

thanks, I'd really appreciate that!

[carninyj]

The minister of one of the local Presbyterian churches here was definitely a combattant. His name was the Rev. William H Hutchison. He was minister of the Cuningham Presbyterian Church (Cullybackey, Co. Antrim) - he took up his post in 1910 - and was Moderator of the Synod of Ballymena and Coleraine when war broke out in 1914. In 1915 he enlisted as a private and became a dispatch rider with the 1st Bn. Royal Irish Rifles. He was commissioned in 1917 and returned to the same battalion as a chaplain. During his military service he was wounded and gassed, and in 1918 he was awarded an MC, allegedly for helping the wounded and showing a complete disregard for his own safety under heavy fire while doing so. He returned to his Cullybackey church in 1918 and remained minister there for the next 14 years.

I'll try an get you a photo later.

Regards

Carninyj

[carninyj]

As promised, the photo of the Reverend William Holmes Hutchison BA, MC

Regards

Carninyj

[swizz]

Thanks - that's really useful since I hadn't heard about this guy and my particular interest is in people from the area which becomes Northern Ireland. Just out of interest, do you know whether he is mentioned in James Taylor's book on the 1st RIR?

The only name I have of an Irish Presbyterian minister actually killed while with a combatant unit is 2/Lt Samuel Linden:

http://www.cwgc.org/cwgcinternet/SearchRes...y&nationality=6

There are a few others with connections to the Presbyterian church though - the Magee College memorial has six or seven names on it. The College was still a Presbyterian training college at that time (as you probably know!)

Swizz

[swizz]

While I was writing that last one you posted the photo - that's brilliant - thanks!

[Jock Bruce]

I have one ordained minister who -

1. DCM serving 9 Royal Scots. Discharged Jan 1916. ACD Feb 16. With 1/5 Seaforth from Sep 17. POW 21 Mar 18. Released Nov 18. MC in gazette of 3 Mar 19.

two who may have been divinity students rather than ordained

2. Enlisted 5 Seaforth Jun 15, no active service with them, commissioned 9 RS Jul 17.

3. Commissioned 5 Seaforth Feb 15. Injured and no active service.

and one who definitely was a divinity student

4. Enlisted 4 Gordons Nov 14, no active service, commissioned 5th Seaforth, to France Jan 17 and served until wounded Apr 17.

Jock

[carninyj]

Swizz

I cannot tell you if he's recorded in the book mentioned. Des 7 might know.

Regards

Carninyj

[Boreenatra]

We have a local who seems to fit the bill. The Rev. Charles Steer M.C. He was formaly Curate of St. Edwards Parish Church in Romford from 1905 to 1910. For some time prior to the war he was in South Africa as Vicar of Randfontein in the Tranvaal. In the summer of 1914 he was on leave in Paris the day war on Germany was declared. He came back to England and endeavered to obtain a post at the front in the ArmyChaplain's Dept. Being unsuccessful he returned to S.A. to try and do his " active service" in the wilds of Northern Transvaal along with all its inherent hardships. He was placed in charge of Zoutpansberg district, and his position involved considerable responsibility in the successful endeavours made to avoid the Dutch rebellion. In 1915 he was summoned to a meeting of the Bishop's Senate which discussed the attitude the Church would take with regard to South African troops being sent to German East Africa. He put up a strong plea for a certain number of clergymen to be allowed to enlist in the ranks, and this project received powerful backing from his brother priests, which was endorsed by a vote.

On the following day he went to Johannesberg and enrolled as a private, together with four other like minded priests. He was called to the colours in October and spent a month or two in training camps in Potchefstroom with the South African Medical Corps, where he was promoted to Corporal and was attached to the 7th South African Infantry.On Dec. 27th 1915 he sailed from Durban and with his unit he saw actions at Salaita Hill, Lumi River and Taveta under General Smuts command and was recommended for the D.C.M.He took part in Van Deventer's forced march to Kondoa Irangi, a matter of some 200 miles, having to manhandle Army Transport through dreadful conditions, having to sleep out in the open in tropical rains and as a consequence fever was rife and medical supplies few and far between.

On 1st June he was appointed Chaplain to the 9th South African Horse, then some 300 miles away from M'Buyuni. Stealing a ride on an M.G. motor going back for repairs he managed to pick up the minimum of kit and proceded to join his regiment They fought at T'schunjo Nek and M'Papua and they managed to get across the German Railway after more heavy fighting.

(this is an extract from his own account of the fighting)

"We thought the enemy would throw his hand in after his railway was lost to him, but we did not know Von Lettow. We had to push him down all the way through the Uluguru Mountains, and fight a heavy action for the water at outside Kissaki. By this time , though a mounted regiment, we were all on foot again, the horses having died of tsetse fly. The men too were in the last stage of weakness, through lack of food and the ever recurring fever. So after capturing Kissaki we proceeded to sit down on one side of the river with the enemy on the other, until food and reinforcements came up. Never will I forget the stink of hundreds of dead horses, nor the "delight" with which we , who had been living on donkey and hippo flesh, with now and then a handful of flour as a treat, and some Kaffir corn pounded into a sort of porridge, received one day a G.R.O, in which it stated that "the pepper ration had been reduced from one forty-fifth to one seventy-second of an ounce per man per day"

They were involved in more actions, although racked with dysentry they managed to surround a large force around Christmas 1916 and managed to treck some hundred miles to Dar es Salam and then on to Durban where the 9th S.A.H. was disbanded.When he arrived in Johannesberg he was met by his Bishop and they quickly drew up plans for a scheme whereby the Diocese should do its bit in Europe. All the clergy of military age were given permission to go home.Nearly half the staff were in France by June 1917 and as he put it " I am glad to say that I was the first of the bunch, in spite of having been warned by the authorities that I was full of malaria and would inevitably die before I reached France"

He was mentioned in Despatches May 30th 1917 by Major General A.R.Hoskins C-I-C East African Force.

On arrival in England he was accepted as a Chaplain in the ACD and after two weeks he was sent to France and attached to the 8th Divisional Artillery with whom he served for a year, going through some heavy fighting in the Ypres Saliant in July and all through the worst in the winter. He was awarded the Military Cross for conspicuous service in connection with the first advance along the Menin Road on July 31st 1917. In March 1918 the division was hastened to the defence of Amiens, and fought all through that retreat. He returned briefly to England where he was married, and then returned to the Western Front. He took part in the British reinforcements of the French line between Chemin Des Dames and Rheims, but fell into the hands of the Germans on 28th May 1918. He was held prisoner in the camp at Rastatt and then at Stralsund, but was repatriated at the end of October, arriving home via Holland 1st Nov. He only remained in England for a few weeks and just before Christmas he was sent again to France with the 19th Corps Headquarters, and was eventually demobed March 31 st 1919.

His decoration of the Military Cross was bestowed upon him by the King at Buckingham Palace on Nov. 7th 1919 and the following being the official announcement of the award.

" Rev Charles Steer. Notwithstanding the heavy shell fire he remained continually in the Batteries, assisting in moving the wounded and encouraging the men. On a previous occasion, during a long period of heavy shelling, he acted with the greatest gallantry and devotion by his personal example, greatly inspiring all ranks under most difficult conditions."

This really says it all I think. Regards Steve

[Cliff. Hobson]

There were two Divinity Students from my Village who served :-

John Richard Carding-Wells 12th York and Lancs., K.I.A. 1st July 1916

Luke Copse British Cemetery.

Frederick Charles Brown 9th Sherwood Foresters K.I.A. 7th August 1915.

Comm., Helles Memorial, Gallipoli.

[carninyj]

London Gazette, 30 July 1919

Swizz,

Here's W H Hutchison's award from the above.

Regards

Carninyj

W_H_Hutchison.BMP

[paullaw1155]

Doing a bit of research today and came across one Irish Anglican minister who informed his Select Vestry of his intention to enlist as a 'combatant.' There's no indication, unfortunately, of whether he went ahead with it or not. I wondered if this often happened? Any others I've come across with war service either served as a Chaplain or else in the RAMC. I wondered whether anyone else had uncovered any similar cases?

Swizz

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There is a article on Tom Morgans Hellfire Corner about three army chaplains who won the Vc. I was in a small town in the Yorkshire dales called Bentham at the weekend noticed a framed notice board showing a group of men swimming in the river in 1913.One of those in the picture was a Reverend Bailey Hardy who later won the VC.

Not sure if this is the type of info you require.

Paul

[Desmond7]

The very boy I was thinking of J - here's another pic. Jimmy Taylor is a member of the forum - try his pm box?

Gallantry Awards

Rev. William Holmes Hutchinson, Royal Army Chaplains department, attached

1st Btn. Royal Irish Rifles and Minister of Cuningham Memorial Presbyterian

Church, Cullybackey.

"Under heavy machine gun and shellfire during the operations south of

Dadizeele on October 2, 1918, he helped to evacuate and render first aid to

the wounded with complete disregard for personal safety. He assisted to

carry two seriously wounded men from the front line to the regimental aid

post, a distance of about one kilometre. He returned to the front line and

continued dressing the wounded under heavy fire. His gallantry and conduct

during the entire operation were marked by all ranks.

Ballymena Observer, August 8, 1919.

[jhill]

I suspect that some, if not most, of these gentlemen would have prefered to have served as chaplains, but were frustrated by the lack of positions.

The war diary of the Canadian Chaplain Services is unfortunately short of much hard information. However, one can glean some information from the changes in personnel. For example, of the 12 chaplains taken on strength in September of 1917, 4 were taken on from the ranks of combatant units. One is tempted to conclude that those fellows joined the ranks because there was no space for them as chaplains. When vacancies occured, some transferred over.

I would be interested in finding out more about this.

[swizz]

Thanks to everyone for their responses. I'm particularly interested in Hutchinson and its always good to be able to put a face to the name!

I wonder whether these men found any difficulty in the possibility that they might have to attempt to kill someone. I would have thought that would have gone against a lot of Christian teaching - although I know in some quarters the war was seen almost as a crusade.

Have realised that I have a photo of the Magee College war memorial I mention above. I'll have a look now and see if I can find it.

Swizz

[swizz]

Success!

Here's the photo of the Magee war memorial. Magee used to train Presbyterian ministers but its now part of the University of Ulster. This plaque is in the Great Hall, which used to be the Exam Hall. Any time I've seen it, it has been polished and seems to be well looked after.

But... looking more carefully at the names, I realise that only one of these men died as a Chaplain. Presumably the others had yet to fully qualify as ministers (Stuart is the only one with 'Rev' before his name). The mystery deepens...!

I hope the picture is of some interest anyway.

Swizz

[Audax]

Success!

Here's the photo of the Magee war memorial. Magee used to train Presbyterian ministers but its now part of the University of Ulster. This plaque is in the Great Hall, which used to be the Exam Hall. Any time I've seen it, it has been polished and seems to be well looked after.

But... looking more carefully at the names, I realise that only one of these men died as a Chaplain. Presumably the others had yet to fully qualify as ministers (Stuart is the only one with 'Rev' before his name). The mystery deepens...!

I hope the picture is of some interest anyway.

Swizz

Some other clergy who served as combatants :-

Rifleman, The Reverend Bernard William King No 46833 2/KRRC. (Volunteered as a chaplain soon after the outbreak of war, but turned down on the grouds of being too short a time in Holy Orders) KIA 23.10.1918.

2nd Lieut. The Reverend Charles Gordon McDonald 1/6th Battalion, Scottish Rifles (The Cameronians) (T.F.) KIA 15.6.1916.

Major, The Reverend Hugh Speke; 10th (Service) Battalion, Lancashire Fusiliers. KIA 11.8.1915.

Captain, The Reverend Lionel Studd, 12th Battalion, (The Rangers), The London Regiment (T.F.). KIA 14.2.1915.

These were all KIA, can anyone add to the list those who also served and survived?

[SteveE]

I've come across one in my research of the 25th Battalion Royal Fusiliers.

Captain, the Revd. Hugh William HUTCHINGS.

According to his MIC he enlisted as a Private in the London Regiment before becoming a Captain in the Royal Fusiliers (although the battalion war diary shows this as an attachment), haven't found this gazetted as yet but I keep looking. MIC also shows him as being in the Royal Army Chaplain's Department.

He was wounded in an action at Narunyu on 18th August 1917 but I believe survived the war.

Steve

[Peter Bennett]

Lt Colonel Bernard William Vann was awarded the VC, MC & Bar, Croix de Guerre (France)

http://www.cwgc.org/cwgcinternet/casualty_...casualty=238721

His epitaph reads " A Great Priest who in his days pleased God"

[Paul Reed]

I just added details of this chap to my Somme site, Rev. S.F.Hutton, who died as a Private in the 8th Royal Fusiliers on the Somme:

http://www.somme-1916.com/soldier011.htm

[Tony Lund]

On the 19th August 1915, the Reverend Beamish, Vicar of Upperthong, and Deputy Chairman of the Recruiting Committee, was answering criticism of clergymen urging men to go to war while staying at home themselves when he wrote : “Lieut. F. E. B. Hulton Sams (a champion boxer, and a clergyman, called the ‘fighting parson’.) He joined as a private.” It seems the Lieutenant's name was among the dead listed in the Church Times.

Tony.

Hulton Sams

[jhill]

In case anyone missed it, we had a previous thread on a similar subject entitled "Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition" ( or something like that).

I contributed a reference to Lieut. G. B. McKean, V.C. , a bio of whom can be seen here .

This fellow was a bit different in that considerable effort seems to have been expended to avoid all mention of his life as a clergyman.

[Audax]

I've come across one in my research of the 25th Battalion Royal Fusiliers.

Captain, the Revd. Hugh William HUTCHINGS.

According to his MIC he enlisted as a Private in the London Regiment before becoming a Captain in the Royal Fusiliers (although the battalion war diary shows this as an attachment), haven't found this gazetted as yet but I keep looking. MIC also shows him as being in the Royal Army Chaplain's Department.

He was wounded in an action at Narunyu on 18th August 1917 but I believe survived the war.

Steve

Steve,

Thanks for the info. Iv'e now looked him up in 'War Services of the Officers of the Army, Etc. 1919.

Entry reads

Hutchings, Rev H.W. (temp. Chapl. 4th Class) -

The War of 1914-19. - Wounded twice. M.C.

I would think he was attached to Royal Fusiliers as a Chaplain. Did you have a note of the award of the M.C.?

[Audax]

In case anyone missed it, we had a previous thread on a similar subject entitled "Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition" ( or something like that).

I contributed a reference to Lieut. G. B. McKean, V.C. , a bio of whom can be seen here .

This fellow was a bit different in that considerable effort seems to have been expended to avoid all mention of his life as a clergyman.

Yes, I see what you mean. No mention of being a Clergyman 'The Register of the Victoria Cross' (1981) either.