RM Museum Gallipoli Conference 28/4/2005

[Jonathan Saunders]

Continuing on from the feedback of the Morning Session I posted yesterday ...

First an amendment as in my haste I forgot Pat Barker's pre-lunch talk about everyday life in the RND on Gallipoli. Her father served on the Peninsula in the RM Brigade and Pat has written what looks like an interesting book "A Quiet Life" about her father's experiences based on the primary sources left by three RND men. Pat's talk discussed the problems with extremities in weather - heat, dust, cold, mud, flooding etc and flies and disease. Also the fact that the men were always kept busy carrying, digging etc and even when out of the line were given no time to recover strength - similar to ORs experiences in other war theatres.

Commander Jeff Tall of the Submarine Museum at Gosport then opened the afternoon session with an outline of submarine development leading up to WW1 and the under-water campaign in the Dardanelles - which was to attack the supply routes and merchant shipping and troop ships rather than capital ships. The submarines were obviously far different and primitive to the subs of today, or even the WW2 era, and were faced in the Narrows with strong tides, mine fields, anti-sub nets, land based torpedos, destroyers etc. They were also faced with terribly cramped conditions and suffocating air pollution. It was evident that the submariners all shared an immense level of courage. I would recommend anybody with an interest on the Silent Service or Gallipoli to look for material on this aspect of the campaign.

Selcuk Kolay - a Turkish expert on shipwreck survey and research then told us of his search for AE2, the first submarine to penetrate into the Sea of Marmara. Although British built the AE2 was an RAN vessel, commanded by an Englishman, Lt Stoker - a descendant of Bram Stoker. After some success they were eventually captured and became POWs. Apparently evidence suggests Hamilton had been on the verge of seeking a withdrawal from Gallipoli until AE2 had proved finding a route into the Sea of Marmara was possible.

Next up was Duncan Dunbar-Nasmith, grandson of the great Martin Dunbar-Nasmith VC, who penetrated onto the sea of Marmara in E11 on three separate occasions during the campaign and was responsible for sinking approximately 40% of the 94 Turkish vessels sunk by Allied submarines. The story of the E11 was very well told by Duncan but I wouldnt know where to start in trying to summarise it here. There is at least one very good book on the exploits of Dunbar-Nasmith (Martin Wills - what is the title?) and having it read it last year I would recommend it highly.

The final session consisted of a lecture by Peter Doyle on the landscape of Gallipoli and how this contributed to the failure of the campaign. Current development of roads, particularly in the ANZAC sector, was also discussed.

Len Sellers gave an overview of what the battlefield tourist can expect to find on the Peninsula and the difficulties that need to be overcome. Len was very appreciative of the help and friendship offered by Turks on the Peninsula.

Zeynip Aygen then told us of the increased awareness associated with Gallipoli and the Turkish viewpoint in the Turkish collective memory. Visitors to galliopli today will be well aware of the increased interest by Turks in the Peninsula and whilst the interest can only be a very good thing it has in part led to the need for better roads etc.

Finally Savas Karaskas showed snippets of his recently released documentary film about the wrecks of Gallipoli with some quite astonishing film photography of what remains beneath the waves.

In all an excellent day and if any of the speakers or those responsible behind the scenes for this Conference have read through my rather poor attempt to provide feedback, many thanks for ensuring the excellent content and maing sure the day went smoothly.

[MartinWills]

Jon,

DARDANELLES PATROL-Peter Shankland-& Anthony Hunter

A very readable account of E11's first voyage into the Marmora and its exploits written to read as a tale but none-the-less fairly accurate. Jon borrowed a copy from me whilst on the Peninsula and was quite engrossed from beginning to end.

As I recall it was originally published around 1970 (1964, now that I've checked) and saw a number of paperback incarnations so it is fairly easy to find and inexpensive. Well worth finding.

As an aside Commander Brodie, whose submarine was lost in the Dardanelles is buried in the Canakkale Consular Cemetery.

A recent piece on Radio 4 of daffodil cultivars focused on the work of a Brodie (ex naval) who have developed a wide range of daffodil cultivars last century and set my mind thinking when it was mentioned that his excellent "Marmora" was thought to be a lost variety and also mentioned another called "Gallipoli". I wondered whether it was the same Brodie family and whether the names reflected connections with the campaign.

Can any daffodil experts enlighten me?

Stoker's AE2 was the subject of a recent book by the Brenchleys called Stoker's Submarine; a play written as I recall 10 or 15 years ago and Stokers own book "Straws in the Wind".

[michaeldr]

Thanks to Signals and to Martin for their reports from the conference

(lucky blighters!)

Much appreciated

Regards

Michael D.R.

[Jonathan Saunders]

A recent piece on Radio 4 of daffodil cultivars focused on the work of a Brodie (ex naval) who have developed a wide range of daffodil cultivars last century and set my mind thinking when it was mentioned that his excellent "Marmora" was thought to be a lost variety and also mentioned another called "Gallipoli". I wondered whether it was the same Brodie family and whether the names reflected connections with the campaign.

Can any daffodil experts enlighten me?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Martin, Whilst not a daffodil expert I can tell you that Brodie ahd a twin brother who was also RN and helped locate the wreck of E15 (in a plane with the legendary Sampson) so it could be destoryed before the Turks had too much of a chance to investigate closely. He also helped brief Dunbar-Nasmith before his venture up the NArrows.

Thanks for your comments Michael. Actually Martin ddint make it either but I met up with Tybers at the event.

[Krithia]

Pat Barker's pre-lunch talk about everyday life in the RND on Gallipoli.

I think the talk was by Pat Francis on her fathers experiences with the RM's, not Barker.

A fantastic conference, hopefully another will be organised next year !

[Jonathan Saunders]

I think the talk was by Pat Francis on her fathers experiences with the RM's, not Barker.

A fantastic conference, hopefully another will be organised next year !

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry ... it was Pat Francis. Pat Barker is someone althogether different