Interpreting Grandfathers War Record

[brupeno55]

My grandfather who was a Chemist, served in the Army Medical Corps and did an overseas trip to Cairo in 1916 on transport duty, which I assume was to accompany injured soldiers (possibly from Gallipoli) on their journey back to Australia as he only did one trip. The Casualty Form - Active Service has the first record on 25.5.16 as "Attached for duty whilst awaiting transport" which was in Heliopolis in Cairo. The second entry on 23.7.16 states "Detailed for transport duty and struck off strength" also in Heliopolis. The final entry is four days later on 27.7.16 from Suez which states "Transport duty to Australia".

Is it fair to assume that he travelled to Cairo, then was assigned to a local unit until the ship was ready to leave with the injured soldiers, and then his duty was to accompany these soldiers back to Australia? Or does the term "struck off strength" mean anything relating to his own health? Or is that simply a reference to him departing and not being part of their manpower strength in that location?

Thank you in advance for any help with this.

 

[kenf48]

Welcome to the GWF

A name often helps, also which Army

I assume the AIF

'Struck off strength' usually means the strength e.g. ration strength of the unit to which he was posted originally presumably the form shows the originating unit

[brupeno55]

Thanks for the reply. Yes it was AIF, and the unit seems to be A.M.C and Ist Auxiliary Hospital. HIs name was Roy Robertson Penman.

There is also a reference to a unit Ist Hawkes Bay and he was Staff Sargent Dispenser. Does this help at all?

[brupeno55]

Also there is a unit reference on another form as follows:

Unit: Dispenser AAM Corps

He was enlisted in Granville Sydney

On his return in 1917-8 he was a medic at the Internee Camp at Trial Bay, South West Rocks NSW

[WhiteStarLine]

11 hours ago, brupeno55 said:

s it fair to assume that he travelled to Cairo, then was assigned to a local unit until the ship was ready to leave with the injured soldiers, and then his duty was to accompany these soldiers back to Australia? Or does the term "struck off strength" mean anything relating to his own health? Or is that simply a reference to him departing and not being part of their manpower strength in that location?

Welcome to the forum and his was an interesting role I've not struck before.  You are absolutely correct - his role was "Hospital Transport" (page 10 of his record) where his skills as a dispensing chemist would have been highly valued.  He would have arrived in Heliopolis and while waiting to accompanied the next draft home, he would have been rationed / accommodated / paid and tasked, then released ("struck off strength") when the Port Sydney was due to sail.

He was allotted to the Field Hospital Liverpool in August 1916 and discharged, Services No Longer Required (S.N.L.R.) in June 1917.  He was entitled to one medal, the British War Medal, which was not issued until 1961.

[brupeno55]

Thank you very much for the detailed response, which has been very informative.

We know that after this service, he was assigned to the Trail Bay Internee Camp at Trial Bay Gaol, South West Rocks NSW as a medical officer and he served there from 2017 to 2018. We have a photo of the names of all the officers that were present at Christmas 2017 and his name is there.  Would there be a site I could search for a service record for his time at the Internee Camp, or from the information above, do we conclude that this latter service was done as a private volunteer perhaps? 

[WhiteStarLine]

9 hours ago, brupeno55 said:

We have a photo of the names of all the officers that were present at Christmas 2017 and his name is there.

I think you need to post this as we want to establish in what capacity he was there (civilian or military).  I am certainly no expert on this side of the military, but if he was discharged from the Army in June 1917 then I wonder if he applied for a dispensary job at the internment camp as a civilian.  This web site talks about 100 guards (photographed in AIF uniform with SMLE rifles) but it would have had a civilian support staff as well.  Interesting to see if the photograph you have lists civilian or military titles.

Your unit reference doesn't say 1st Hawkes Bay at all - it says S/S Hawkes Bay.  As I can't see when he left Sydney, perhaps he was attached to the Hawkes Bay NZ troopship HMNZT No. 9   This ship sailed from Wellington to Sydney then in convoy with the AIF and they would have needed a dispenser on board.

 

[rksimpson]

Hi

 

There may be some hint here -

https://heuristplus.sydney.edu.au/heurist/?db=ExpertNation&ll=Beyond1914

"was on Home Service until the end of the War"

You could maybe answer some of the gaps they have for him too?

regards

Robert

[brupeno55]

Thanks everyone for the information - terrific to have my gaps filled by the knowledge you have. 

The list of the Trail Bay Guards from Christmas 2017 is attached - alphabetically he is last, as Staff Sgt which indicates that he retained his rank.

I understand now that on his return to Australia, he was returned to duty by the Australian Military Forces and allotted to the Field Hospital Liverpool.

Thus, I assume, retaining his rank and being assigned to the Internee Camp as Staff Sergeant as part of his Home Service duties.

[WhiteStarLine]

1 hour ago, brupeno55 said:

alphabetically he is last, as Staff Sgt which indicates that he retained his rank.

Completely agree.

I cannot find any evidence of this on the National Archives, but that is because I don't know how to search for Australian soldiers under the Universal Service Scheme.  I can find PTE Raahauge by searching ADF Personnel Records instead of WW1 records and I can see that he did not serve with the AIF but is recorded as a guard.  For SSGT Penman I can only find the AIF record, from which his services were terminated in June 1917.  Nor can I find Major Holborrow except via Google.

The SS Hawkes Bay left Sydney in the original convoy, then Convoy 13 on 23.10.15 and Convoy 20 on 21.4.16.

So, a most interesting story - thanks for sharing.

 

[brupeno55]

Thank you very much for the information and the interpretation, which has given me and the extended family a much better understanding of his service.

It is curious that he never collected his service medals, perhaps because he didn't serve on the front line, and in those days, the focus of Anzac Day and remembrance days was more about the diggers. His widow, my grandmother, requested them after he died.

[WhiteStarLine]

Great that the extended family now has a better understanding of how valuable his contribution was.  There would be sick and wounded men who owed their lives to his dispensary skills.  If you compare the achievements of the RAMC with a different era, such as Crimea, you can trace their immense impact on the number of fighting men available to the generals.

Just to be a tad picky, he earned a war medal, not medals.  The red stamp N/E means no entitlement.

Cheers, Bill

[brupeno55]

Thanks Bill...yet another clarification that is so obvious now you point it out. 

Greatly appreciate all the help

Cheers

Bruce