William Greer

[Eastindia]

Having failed to find any military record relating to the fellow below in the hope that someone else more expert than I can find anything I am seeking help

He Survived WWI and is not one of the eight William Greers who did not. As an ex Oxbridge man and a civil servant I am assuming that if he enlisted in 1915 aged 35 he would have been commissioned, though I appreciate that he could have gone into the ranks. I am assuming he  participated even retiring from India expressly to do so
I rather fear that he will be indistinguishable from other William Greers

Any info greatly appreciated 

 

William Greer, ICS

He was born 24th May 1880 at Boghead House, Muckamore, Belfast and was the son of Hugh and Elizabeth (Lizzie) née Reid Greer.

He was educated at Harrow School and Pembroke College, Cambridge and Bailliol College, Oxford.

He entered the Indian Civil Service by examination 1903, arriving 1904. He served in Bombay as assistant magistrate and collector, and assistant  judge; retired 1915.

[PRC]

Neither the Harrow School Register, the War List of the University of Cambridge or the Oxford University Roll of Service is showing a likely match, although I am only doing an F5 search rather than eyeballing every page.
https://archive.org/details/oxforduniversity00univuoft/mode/2up?q=Greer

https://archive.org/details/warlistofunivers00careuoft/page/566/mode/2up?q=Greer

Of course all three sources may have been dependant on him informing them he was serving.

Cheers,
Peter

 

[Matlock1418]

1 hour ago, Eastindia said:

He Survived WWI

Any idea where he might have considered home during the war? - I'm particularly thinking Absent Voters Lists and/or pension records

and later lived post-war? - I'm thinking 1921 Census

???

M

Edited 13 April by Matlock1418

[corisande]

This could be him arriving UK from India on 25 Oct 1914. He is 34, and travels 2nd class. ICS. He cannot have been senior in ICS if he travelled 2nd class

I think that is 2 Clement Rd. Wimbledon is his intended address

The 1914 voters list shows Hugh Greer living there, which is probably his father. It needs work to substantiate that

Edited 13 April by corisande

[corisande]

By 1921 census on FmP  Hugh (his brother?) is living with his mother at 2 Clement Rd, Wimbledon.

Hugh is a Clerk at Min of  Health living with his mother, who is now widowed

Edited 13 April by corisande

[corisande]

His birth you probably have from Irish GRO

 

Muckamore is just outside Antrim town. And Boghead is a fairly modest dwelling 7 and his father is a clerk

 

To that extent it is surprising that he went to Harrow, Oxford and Cambridge

[PRC]

1 hour ago, corisande said:

I think that is 2 Clement Rd. Wimbledon is his intended address

I can't find a Census return for 2 Clement Road, Wimbledon on the 1911 Census of England & Wales but elsewhere in Wimbledon at 27 Homefield Road there is a household headed up by a 66 year old widow Elizabeth G. Greer, living on Private Means and born Grange of Muckamore, County Antrim. Other household members include Hugh Greer, aged 28, single, born Muckamore and a Clerk 2nd Division Estate Duty Office as well as Elizabeths' sister and two live in servants.

Looks like that Elizabeth and Hugh are a strong match for the main residents at 2 Clement Road on the 1921 Census of England & Wales.

Cheers,
Peter

[Eastindia]

He was living at the address in Wimbledon in 1904 before he went to work in India. Hugh was his younger brother who was also at Harrow. Hugh also passed the Indian Civil Service but chose not to go and instead worked in Somerset House and remain in London. Their father Hugh was already dead. I presume William will have remained in London. His mother Elizabeth moved to Folkestone later on. I have not found William in 1921 census nor 1939 register but he was alive in 1930s. He may not have served in WWI though eligible. He doesn’t appear on the two college rolls. He just seems to have slipped into obscurity. Staying in the same junior position throughout his eleven year career is very unusual

i guess that’s as far as one can get. I would not Know which William Greer probate might be his.

 

[Eastindia]

Peter, that’s his mother and brother. Margaret Reid was the mother’s sister.

peter, Corisande and Maltlock many thanks for your interest and help which is much appreciated 

[PRC]

The death of the 86 year old Elizabeth Gilchrist Greer was registered in the Bakewell District of Derbyshire in Q1 1932. I'm not readily spotting anything in the Probate Calendar, but a search of the British Newspaper Archive just using her full name as the search criteria does bring up an official notice in the edition of the Folkestone, Hythe, Sandgate & Cheriton Herald advising that "claims under the Trustees Act......" (don't subscribe, so can't see the whole article).

The fuller notice may make reference to either William or Hugh or possibly both, so may be worth checking out as it would be an indicator that they were still alive.

Going on that 24th May 1880 date of birth for William and that lack of any middle names, one of the potential matches if William died in England & Wales was the death of a 74 year old William Greer which was recorded in the Colchester District of Essex in Q1 1955. That years probate calendar records that a William Greer of Brickwall Farm, Layer-de-la-Haye near Colchester died on the 12th March 1955. Probate was granted to Peggy de Billinghurst Freda Greer, widow,  Clara Louise Ludford, (wife of Albert Edward Ludford), and Annie Greer Gilchrist Reid Murray, spinster.

A webpage on the Mersea Musuem website has a piece on Layer-de-la-Haye and has mentions of Peggy de Billinghurst Freda Bowen-Colthurst who was farming in the area after her family were driven out of Ireland by Sinn Fein, including a photograph, and that she married in 1938 to a William Greer, also from Ireland. https://merseamuseum.org.uk/mmresdetails.php?pid=PH01_ARV&ba=mmpeldon.php

I couldn't initially spot the couple on the 1939 Register as Greer's living at Layer-de-la-Haye on the Find MyPast indexing but that was because they have been mis-transcribed as Green. The couple were living at Layer Farm, Layer-de-la-Haye. William is indexed as born 1880. Again I don't subscribe, so can't check the details, but hopefully the date of birth will help rule him in or out as a match.

Cheers,
Peter

[Eastindia]

Peter, You really have come up trumps. I found the same probate details for William. Reid was his mother’s maiden name which is reflected in one of the names recorded.Thank you very much

I can find no trace of Peggy orvwiiliam in the 1939 register but there is a hidden name by Winifred’s 

revised entry thanks to you and Corisande

William Greer, ICS

He was born 24th May 1880 at Boghead House, Muckamore, Belfast and was the son of Hugh and Elizabeth (Lizzie) née Reid Greer.

He was educated at Harrow School and Pembroke College, Cambridge and Bailliol College, Oxford.

He entered the Indian Civil Service by examination 1903, arriving 1904. He served in Bombay as assistant magistrate and collector, and assistant  judge; retired 1915.

His name does not appear in rolls of honour of Pembroke and Bailliol colleges as having served in WWI and no record has otherwise been found though he was at 34 in 1914 liable to service. His health or a reserved occupation may have exempted him.

He married Peggy de Billinghurst Freda Colthurst Bowen (1882-1970) 9th February 1939 in St. John the Baptist Church, Layer de la Haye, Colchester Essex. His wife owned the farm having fled Dripsey Castle in Co. Cork in 1919 when her life was threatened. Mersea Museum on its website in its account on the Abberton Reservoir gives a fascinating account of her background

He died 12th March 1955, aged 74, at Brickwall Farm, Layer de la Haye, Essex

[Eastindia]

[Eastindia]

I have found his and Peggy’s details on 1939 registry under Green

i apologise for my failed attempts to show a copy 

[corisande]

3 hours ago, Eastindia said:

He married Peggy de Billinghurst Freda Colthurst Bowen (1882-1970) 9th February 1939 in St. John the Baptist Church, Layer de la Haye, Colchester Essex. His wife owned the farm having fled Dripsey Castle in Co. Cork in 1919 when her life was threatened. Mersea Museum on its website in its account on the Abberton Reservoir gives a fascinating account of her background

 

Yes, she is a sister of Captain John Bowen-Colthurst, who is infamous in Ireland

I quote from an RTE (Irish radio & TV)

Dublin, 17 October 1916 - The Royal Commission on the Portobello Shootings has said that the shooting of three unarmed men in the Portobello barracks during the Easter Rising ‘constitutes the offence of murder, whether martial law has been proclaimed or not.’

The Royal Commission was established to investigate the events at Portobello barracks where Francis Sheehy Skeffington, Thomas Dickson and Patrick McIntyre were murdered  by a British Army officer Captain J.C. Bowen-Colthurst.

He was subsequently found ‘guilty, but insane’ by court-martial.

The Royal Commission was established following an outpouring of grief and anger from the Sheehy Skeffington family and their friends.

The family wrote to the British Prime Minister Herbert Asquith to complain that in the days after the murder, Captain Bowen-Colthurst had sent a search party to their home.

Further, he remained at large for two weeks after the murder and, most striking of all, he ordered a second execution team to shoot again at Francis Sheehy Skeffington as he lay on the ground, following a report that the dying man had twitched where he lay.

The Royal Commission has found that the testimony of Captain Bowen-Colthurst and his account of the occurrences was ‘wholly untrue’.

 

And a book on the subject - A Terrible Duty: The Madness of Captain Bowen-Colthurst

Captain John Colthurst Bowen-Colthurst had an illustrious career before he encountered Francis Sheehy-Skeffington during the 1916 Easter Rising. On April 25/26, 1916, Captain Colthurst shot Sheehy-Skeffington and several other unarmed civilians in Dublin. A court martial found him guilty of murder but insane, and he was sentenced to indefinite incarceration in Broadmoor Lunatic Asylum. But Colthurst was 'cured' and released after nineteen months. He immigrated to the wilds of British Columbia, where he was successively a soldier/settler, an aspiring politician, and a hobby farm orchardist until his death in 1965. In the postscript, the editor concludes that Colthurst's court martial was a travesty of justice and that Colthurst was not insane, at least in the legal sense, at the time he ordered Dickson, MacIntyre and Skeffington to be shot.

 

[Eastindia]

Fascinating. Many thanks, Corisande