Recording of Death

[MDPMicahDominicParsons]

Hello everyone,

I was wondering when units in the frontline would take a role call and how this would have been carried out?

I am also rather curious to find out when a soldiers death would have been recorded for example, I have records of a soldier who was killed in action with the official date of death as Sunday 11th March 1917 but the records taken at the time all list the date of Saturday 10th March 1917 and I was wondering how these dates of death would have been recorded and later changed.

Thank you so much for all your help and support!

Best Wishes,

Micah Dominic Parsons

[Chesterboy]

5 hours ago, MDPMicahDominicParsons said:

Hello everyone,

I was wondering when units in the frontline would take a role call and how this would have been carried out?

I am also rather curious to find out when a soldiers death would have been recorded for example, I have records of a soldier who was killed in action with the official date of death as Sunday 11th March 1917 but the records taken at the time all list the date of Saturday 10th March 1917 and I was wondering how these dates of death would have been recorded and later changed.

Thank you so much for all your help and support!

Best Wishes,

Micah Dominic Parsons

Please can you post a copy of the document in question 

[FROGSMILE]

6 hours ago, MDPMicahDominicParsons said:

Hello everyone,

I was wondering when units in the frontline would take a role call and how this would have been carried out?

I am also rather curious to find out when a soldiers death would have been recorded for example, I have records of a soldier who was killed in action with the official date of death as Sunday 11th March 1917 but the records taken at the time all list the date of Saturday 10th March 1917 and I was wondering how these dates of death would have been recorded and later changed.

Thank you so much for all your help and support!

Best Wishes,

Micah Dominic Parsons

There was a daily roll taken as a routine whenever possible.  Also a roll was taken immediately after a specific action as long as circumstances permitted.  The ‘parade state’ (as it was usually termed) was vital because it drove the manning statistics necessary for the reports and returns submitted up the chain-of-command so that drafts of replacements could be dispatched forward and keep units at fighting strength. 

Edited 12 March by FROGSMILE

[MDPMicahDominicParsons]

Hello everyone,

Thank you so much for all your help and support!

Do you have any idea if any of these roll call documents still exist?

How often would a role call be taken when a unit was in the front line?

Thank you so much for all your help!

Best Wishes,

Micah Dominic Parsons

[FROGSMILE]

2 hours ago, MDPMicahDominicParsons said:

Hello everyone,

Thank you so much for all your help and support!

Do you have any idea if any of these roll call documents still exist?

How often would a role call be taken when a unit was in the front line?

Thank you so much for all your help!

Best Wishes,

Micah Dominic Parsons

1.  No the roll calls are extended unlikely to have survived as they were consumable documents and there was no reason to keep them.

2.  I’ve explained that the roll was taken/called daily as a minimum. 

Edited 12 March by FROGSMILE

[Pat Atkins]

In terms of dates of death, a roll call taken (by company?) after a significant action, such as an attack, might not uncover clear details of the time or even day of death. The roll call would involve a man’s name being called, and survivors providing any details they knew of his fate. Obviously, exhausted men might not be very clear on when a man died (or even if - many men were posted as “missing”).
 

As an example, the 47th (2nd London) Brigade assaulted the German front line at Givenchy on 25/2th May 2915. 1/23rd Londons took their objective on 25th and held it under heavy fire (artillery and enfilade rifle and machine gun) in extremely difficult circumstances until relieved on 26th; their extensive fatalities were each allocated 25th or 26th as date of death - but most occurred sometime during the night and it is hard to feel sure in many cases. The roll call would have been taken soon after they were relieved.

 

 

[FROGSMILE]

14 hours ago, Pat Atkins said:

In terms of dates of death, a roll call taken (by company?) after a significant action, such as an attack, might not uncover clear details of the time or even day of death. The roll call would involve a man’s name being called, and survivors providing any details they knew of his fate. Obviously, exhausted men might not be very clear on when a man died (or even if - many men were posted as “missing”).
 

As an example, the 47th (2nd London) Brigade assaulted the German front line at Givenchy on 25/2th May 2915. 1/23rd Londons took their objective on 25th and held it under heavy fire (artillery and enfilade rifle and machine gun) in extremely difficult circumstances until relieved on 26th; their extensive fatalities were each allocated 25th or 26th as date of death - but most occurred sometime during the night and it is hard to feel sure in many cases. The roll call would have been taken soon after they were relieved.

 

 

Yes I agree with all that you say Pat and in such circumstances where a fate was not known the man would be listed as missing.  From a company viewpoint (you’re correct that roll calls were usually at that level) that man was still a casualty.  The roll would generally read:  Present xx, Dead xx, Wounded xx, Missing xx, Wounded and Missing.  At the end of the process the unit’s strength and losses would have been ascertained in simple arithmetical terms.  The men listed as Missing would remain as such while investations were made, including through the International Red Cross.  If nothing had been heard after a set period the category was changed to Missing believed killed and then after a much longer period Assumed killed.  That’s how I’ve understood it to be anyway, but happy to be corrected by those with more intimate knowledge.

Edited 13 March by FROGSMILE

[MDPMicahDominicParsons]

Hello everyone,

Thank you so much for all your help and support!

Best Wishes,

Micah Dominic Parsons