Colleen Mason Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 Joseph Watson Brockway (no. 161324) Joseph was my great grandfather, and was a Stoker and worked his way up to being a Stoker Petty Officer. When he enlisted in 1891 for whatever reason he gave his name as John William. I have managed to find every ship he served on until I reached this. A reading programme I use on my computer is finding it difficult to read the name of the ship in between Warrior and Firequeen. Whatever it was he seems to have served two terms on it. I have also found a newspaper article from Joseph’s local newspaper dated June 26th 1917 where he is mentioned as Chief Stoker Brockway and in receipt of a Military Medal.I have searched Medal Cards but can’t find anything unless it is a different number , it doesn’t seem to appear on his record. So I have no idea what kind of medal it was, unless for long service. As far as I know his term of engagement finished on the 10th of July 1913, he then joined the Royal Fleet Reserve the following day . Would the A3810 be a new service number? If it is then maybe I have bee using the wrong number. His term of engagement came to an end in February 1919 at HMS Columbine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 (edited) The ship's name is Erebus. He appears to have received the British War Medal according to his entry in the WW1 naval medal roll. Edited 27 October , 2023 by bootneck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 (edited) “HMS Erebus was a First World War monitor launched on 19 June 1916 and which served in both world wars. She and her sister ship Terrorare known as the Erebus class. They were named after the two bomb vessels sent to investigate the Northwest Passage as part of Franklin's lost expedition (1845–1848).” Here she is: Edited 27 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootneck Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 Frogsmile, a different ship I'm afraid. The Erebus I was referring to was launched as HMS Invincible in 1869; she had her engines removed in 1901 and became a depot ship at Sheerness and renamed Erebus in 1904 before becoming a training ship at Portsmouth in 1906 and renamed Fisgard II which sank in a storm in September 1914. regards Bootneck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 "Military Medal" ------ could be he was awarded the RN Long Service medal. If can post all of his ADM188 there would be a notification in the Remarks column that indicates this -- ie: "Traced med: with a date. His RFR A prefix indicates he was in receipt of an A class full pension. He completed his 22 year term of service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 (edited) 33 minutes ago, bootneck said: Frogsmile, a different ship I'm afraid. The Erebus I was referring to was launched as HMS Invincible in 1869; she had her engines removed in 1901 and became a depot ship at Sheerness and renamed Erebus in 1904 before becoming a training ship at Portsmouth in 1906 and renamed Fisgard II which sank in a storm in September 1914. regards Bootneck Thank you Bootneck, I should have checked so I am kicking myself, as I know that the names repeat and that they’re also sometimes renamed whilst still in commission. Here is Invincible a year after commissioning, I wonder how much she was pared down before she became Fisguard II. The masts and stack would have gone I guess. Edited 27 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horatio2 Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 1 hour ago, RNCVR said: "Military Medal" ------ could be he was awarded the RN Long Service medal. No LS & GC Medal because his continuous 'VG' Conduct only dated from 31 December 1906, he having been downgraded to 'Good' (and dis-rated) in 1905. So he did not achieve the necessary 15 years of 'VG' before being discharged to pension in 1913. No Military Medal. He could only have earned the MM with the Royal Naval Division in ther BEF but his entire war was spent in the depot ship HMS WOOLWICH with no sea time. In conclusion, he was never a Stoker Chief Petty Officer and, as previously noted, his only medal was the British War Medal, which he claimed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 Thanks for clarification horatio. One thing I have learned over 50+ yrs of collecting medals is one can never accept at face value anything printed in a newspaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horatio2 Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, Colleen Mason said: he then joined the Royal Fleet Reserve the following day . Would the A3810 be a new service number? Pensioners did not incur any fresh liability by enrolling in Class A. of the Reserve. As Pensioners they are already liable to be called upon by the Admiralty to serve in the Fleet in an emergency. Class A.- Life Pensioners drew no daily retainer but received a Reserve Pension of 5d. a day at 50 years of age in addition to their life Pension. His full RN Official Number after joining the RFR was 161324 (RFR (Portsmouth) A.3810). Edited 27 October , 2023 by horatio2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Mason Posted 27 October , 2023 Author Share Posted 27 October , 2023 I would like to say a big thank you to you all for your help. Maybe with the vast knowledge you all have, you could get together and write an accessible book ,on reading and finding Naval records. Well I have another ship to add to my ever growing collection. What a lot of information you have all come up with. I think I may have got the jist of what is said. I did go and listen to the remarks column about medals but there is no record of a medal, so what Joseph got was a Long Service Medal.As I’m new to the Navy game am I right in that dis-rated is the same as being demoted whatever he might have done, and what does ‘No sea time’mean, did HMS Woolwich only go around the British Coast? Thank you all once again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horatio2 Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 (edited) 51 minutes ago, Colleen Mason said: what Joseph got was a Long Service Medal. No, he did not qualify for the RN Long Service and Good Conduct (LS & GC)Medal. He only earned the British War Medal. 51 minutes ago, Colleen Mason said: what does ‘No sea time’mean, did HMS Woolwich only go around the British Coast? She was a harbour-bound depot ship. Had she been a sea-going warship her crew (and your GGF) would have qualified for the Victory Medal and the 1914-15 Star. Edited 27 October , 2023 by horatio2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 1 hour ago, Colleen Mason said: I would like to say a big thank you to you all for your help. Maybe with the vast knowledge you all have, you could get together and write an accessible book ,on reading and finding Naval records. Well I have another ship to add to my ever growing collection. As I’m new to the Navy game am I right in that dis-rated is the same as being demoted whatever he might have done Thank you all once again. Disrated means he was reduced in rate for some reaon, possibly disciplinary or incompetance in his trade. It could be either temporary or permanent. ie: Leading Stoker to Stoker 1. Of couse that lead to a loss in pay for the rating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horatio2 Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 1 hour ago, Colleen Mason said: am I right in that dis-rated is the same as being demoted whatever he might have done Yes. .You will see in his records that his rating goes from Stoker to Leading Stoker and then back to Stoker in mid-1905. The nature of his 'crime' is not stated. I have also just noted that he was discharged from the RN in June 1903 after completing the twelve-years of the Continuous Service Engagement that he signed for. He then joined the RFR (Portsmouth B.714) but only for three weeks. Unusually, he then rejoined the RN for a further ten years to complete time for pension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 Stokers were a rough tough bunch, & as a result frequently got themselves into trouble with the myrid of naval regs, so he could have been disrated for any number of offences, but nothing really serious to attract cell/detention time. It might have been for incompetance as well, especially if he did not get along with his Engineer watch officer. I cannot read his ADM188 on the NA sight (eyesight) did he get re-rated to Sto1 later in his career? I expect yes as he subsequently made Sto PO(?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horatio2 Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 He was rated Stoker Petty Officer very quickly - February 1907 - lessons learned, apparently! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 27 October , 2023 Share Posted 27 October , 2023 Then he was not likely disrated for incompetance. Unfortunate he missed RN LS but many were ineligable for minor offences in that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Mason Posted 27 October , 2023 Author Share Posted 27 October , 2023 Thank you all once again. I have hopefully attached his complete record, due to issues with eyesight issues it can be difficult. They say doctors have bad handwriting , not sure the Navy were much better, and it looks as though they were saving on paper too! I think I’ve finally got it sorted in my head and know a little more about my great grandfather. From what I’ve read about Stokers they liked a good fight and were very hardworking men. Not sure I’d like to cross them! I’m proud to say he’s part of my family. Joseph’s father was also a Stoker as was his brother. Sadly he lost a son who was a leading telegraphist on HMS Narborough . Many thanks again for your patience and kindness. I’m now off to lay down in a darkened room and recover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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