CMm Posted 5 October , 2023 Share Posted 5 October , 2023 Hi there, I was wondering if anyone could help me to find out more information about my great-grandfather Thomas McKirdy? He was a gunner in the RGA, 2504?# Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Michelle Young Posted 6 October , 2023 Admin Share Posted 6 October , 2023 Welcome to the forum. It would be helpful if you can share what you already know. Do you have his medals? I see there are 4 Thomas McKirdy in the Artillery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 6 October , 2023 Share Posted 6 October , 2023 He drowned in 1919 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 6 October , 2023 Share Posted 6 October , 2023 (edited) Which then gives you Soldiers Effects and his grave With his photo and this information Husband of Elizabeth McKirdy, of 83 Montague Street, Rothesay Died 2 Feb 1919 Thessaloniki, Regional unit of Thessaloniki, Central Macedonia, Greece Edited 6 October , 2023 by corisande Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 6 October , 2023 Share Posted 6 October , 2023 And there is a pension card for his widow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Michelle Young Posted 6 October , 2023 Admin Share Posted 6 October , 2023 @CSMMo might also be able to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 6 October , 2023 Share Posted 6 October , 2023 An Ancestry tree that looks correct says 1885 Feb 19 •Born - Rothesay, Buteshire, Scotland 1891 census at High St, Rothesay Agnes McKirdy 37 Maggie McKirdy 15 Rachel McKirdy 11 Thomas McKirdy 6 Daniel McKirdy 2 1901 census Living as a lodger in Rothesay 1911 Sep 25 Marriage at Paisley, Renfrewshire, Scotland to Elizabeth 'Lizzie' Fletcher Steel 1919 Feb 2 Drowned at Thessaloniki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSMMo Posted 6 October , 2023 Share Posted 6 October , 2023 7 hours ago, Michelle Young said: @CSMMo might also be able to help. Nope. They've pretty much covered it. From my Nominal Roll: McKirdy, Thomas #300525 Gnr – Bute Died (drowned) 2 Feb 1919, he was the husband of Elizabeth McKirdy of 83 Montague St., Rothesay. He is buried at Mikra British Cemetery, Kalamaria, Greece, BMB/AMB #2504 was his pre-1917 number. He started in the Bute Mountain Battery and was transferred to the Argyll Mountain Battery. It also looks, from the medal roll, as if he was one who transferred into the Argyll Battery for Gallipoli, entering the theatre in October 1915. From the War Diary, February 1919: Argyll Mountain Battery RGA (T) VOL. XXXI Page I Period 1st to 28th Feby 1919 (I) SITUATION During the month the battery remained encamped at Kilo 7 ½ Seres Road. The usual battery routine was carried out. A considerable number of N.C.O.’s & men were dispatched from the unit for demobilization & on the 25th day of the month 129 horses & mules were returned to 43rd Remount Depot. (III) PERSONNEL OR’s During the month 12 OR’s were dispatched for demobilization & 2 OR for leave. 8 OR were transported to No. 2 Mountain Btry Argyll Mountain Battery RGA (T) VOL. XXXI Page I Period 1/28th Feby 1919 (III) HEALTH & STRENGTH The health of the battery during the month remained good. 4 OR being evacuated to hospital & 10 OR rejoined the unit from hospital. 1 gunner died during the month from drowning. At the commencement of the month the effective strength of the battery was:- O OR 3 150 At the close of the month O OR 3 150 {signed} E.A. Armour Capt RGA O.C. Argyll Mtn. Battery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 9 October , 2023 Share Posted 9 October , 2023 On 06/10/2023 at 08:52, corisande said: Shows SA for 3 [Separation Allowance - typically this number would be for children] The £8 Grant [for incidental expenses associated with her husband's death] also rather suggests three children [thence £5 for her plus £1, £1 & £1 for the children] The DEAD 1931 indicates the end of the claim so widow was most commonly either remarried or dead and the youngest child had reached 16y or died by then when their pension and/or allowance would cease. M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMm Posted 30 March Author Share Posted 30 March Hi there, that is a different Thomas McKirdy from my great grandfather but thank you so much for all that information. This Thomas McKirdy was married to Mary Pendreigh and had 2 children Neil & Annie. He died in 1977. Here are some photos of him. I've Also included a photo we found in my grans belongings and it simply says 'The Argyll's' on the back? Thank you again and sorry for late reply, I could not remember the website name or my login. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSMMo Posted 30 March Share Posted 30 March How about this Thomas McKirdy? McKirdy, Thomas #300432 Gnr – A joiner from Kerrycroy Village, Isle of Bute, who worked for Alex. Brown on Mill St. Rothesay, he joined the BMB 16 Mar 1912. It appears he might have been held back in the UK due to a back injury suffered in Sept 1914. He also had defective vision since birth. He was sent to Egypt to join RMB in 24 Jun 1916, and then stayed with them through the Salonika Campaign BMB/RMB Those are the two Thomas McKirdys I have in my Nominal Roll, but I make no claims to the roll being 100% complete. Both the Thomas McKirdys would have had a four digit Regt. number. I wonder if they were related as many members of the 4th Highland Brigade were (as well as other TF units). I would keep an open mind about 2504 being your great grandfather's first Regimental Number as there is strong documentation that that is the Thomas McKirdy who drowned in Greece. However, as I have seen and documented, information about the 4th Highland Mountain Brigade, even in Official Histories can be wrong. The Argylls looks like a between-wars photo. The only cap badge I could see looked to be Royal Artillery even as a group photo referred to as "The Argylls" would seem to mean the Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders, but they would have had different cap pieces and probably a couple of kilts thrown in! Maybe the Argyll Battery (which changed from Mountain Artillery to Pack Artillery to Anti-Tank Artillery between wars). Great photos. If it looks like your great grandfather, I can email you a short history of them at Gallipoli. Mike Morrison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 30 March Share Posted 30 March I am confused now Originally the poster said "He was a gunner in the RGA, 2504?# " We have given what I think is internally consistent information on that man birth, marriage and death by drowning the original poster now says "that is a different Thomas McKirdy from my great grandfather" So can we conclude that your great grandfather was not the #2504 that you stated was him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 30 March Share Posted 30 March 3 hours ago, CMm said: This Thomas McKirdy was married to Mary Pendreigh and had 2 children Neil & Annie. He died in 1977. The only way you can solve this without guessing (as the bad Ancestry trees have done) is to get the Marriage cert from Scotlands people, then Thomas McKirdy's birth cert using the marriage info for his parents, You can then get the 1911 census With all that info you are in a position to build his army career Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 30 March Share Posted 30 March 2 minutes ago, corisande said: The only way you can solve this without guessing (as the bad Ancestry trees have done) is to get the Marriage cert from Scotlands people, OK, found the MC online He was born KerryCroy, Bute to Thomas and Isabella (nee Black) So it looks like the man highlighted by @CSMMo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 30 March Share Posted 30 March (edited) 26 minutes ago, CSMMo said: McKirdy, Thomas #300432 Gnr – A joiner from Kerrycroy Village, Isle of Bute, who worked for Alex. Brown on Mill St. Rothesay, Thomas McKIRDY, 300432, Royal Garrison Artillery put in an unspecified disability pension claim on Disembodiment 11.6.19 - he was Rejected. Handily though his PIC also show the number 2296 which I would take as his earlier TF no. M Edited 30 March by Matlock1418 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Michelle Young Posted 30 March Admin Share Posted 30 March Hopefully, it won’t be another 5 months until @CMm returns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alantwo Posted 30 March Share Posted 30 March 35 minutes ago, CSMMo said: Thomas McKirdy who drowned in Greece. Mike I have a note that 300452 J Sinclair, Ross Battery, also drowned the same day; same incident? Both buried in Mikra British Cemetery. Regards Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 30 March Share Posted 30 March (edited) 4 minutes ago, alantwo said: 300452 J Sinclair, Ross Battery, also drowned Briefly as this is now a bit of an aside: John SINCLAIR, also from Rothesay [from WFA/Fold3 pension index card] M Edited 30 March by Matlock1418 source Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSMMo Posted 30 March Share Posted 30 March 1 hour ago, alantwo said: Mike I have a note that 300452 J Sinclair, Ross Battery, also drowned the same day; same incident? Both buried in Mikra British Cemetery. Regards Alan Thanks Alan. It is interesting, however, I have not been able to find any further information on it. As both men were from the Isle of Bute, I would bet it was written up in The Buteman. Their past copies are on microfilm in the Rothesay Library (8.000 miles away, unfortunately). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alantwo Posted 31 March Share Posted 31 March Thanks both, it was just a thought that the events for one man might have informed the other, albeit the Thomas McKirdy originally referred to in the OP. Regards Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMm Posted 11 April Author Share Posted 11 April @CSMMo thank you very much that Thom Mckirdy married to Mary Pendreigh is my great grandfather. I literally just got 3 lines to find him by a family member who is in their 80s and doesn't live on island. There are two families on island with exact same spelling of McKirdy and are not related which made this even more confusing for me. Which is why I'm thankful for this thread. @corisande I apologise for the confusion but as I stated before I only got 3 lines of information to go by which is why I posted in here and I am glad I did! Thank you for the information it was very kind of you to look and help me out. I am completely new to family researching so all help is appreciated. @Matlock1418 so would they not have the same number all the way through war? He would have 2 numbers? So confusing *** Thank you for all the information. Again I am sorry for late reply but we recently lost my gran (Thomas daughter in law) and it has been a sad time for my family so family tree was last thing on my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock1418 Posted 11 April Share Posted 11 April 8 hours ago, CMm said: would they not have the same number all the way through war? He would have 2 numbers? So confusing *** Two numbers was quite simple compared to some men Unique Army Service Numbers did not appear until the 1920's Prior to that Other Ranks [OR] would have Regimental Numbers - these were not unique in that a man could have a battalion prefix, these being most commonly shown in non-regular battalions e.g. the Territorial Force so for example in the 'Blankshire Regiment' in the 5th Bn of there could be a 5/1234 and in the 6th Bn there could be a 6/1234 - commonly the pre-fix would be dropped/lost on paperwork so it could end up looking like there were two different men each with the number 1234. And that was just for the infantry! https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/a-soldiers-life-1914-1918/letter-prefixes-to-british-soldiers-numbers-in-the-first-world-war This sort of potential confusion was a problem for the TF so in 1917 they renumbered all men, commonly with new six-digit Regimental Numbers https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/a-soldiers-life-1914-1918/renumbering-of-the-territorial-force-in-1917 - this link has further links to non-infantry units This helped a bit but an OR would again change his Regimental Number to another regiment's Regimental Number if he changed regiment, potentially again and again as he moved around the Army. So in the 1920s a unique SN system was started for OR - commonly seven-digit and later eight-digit https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/a-soldiers-life-1914-1918/new-british-army-numbers-issued-in-1920 Officers didn't have a number during the war but in the 1920s they too got numbers [OR who commissioned then ended up with a new/second officer's number - until only a few years ago this practice continued]. Nowadays all OR and officers have a unique eight-digit number which will be used all their career. Realised rather late that the LLT could have done all the talking [and better than me] - so it would be well worth looking at the links I have retrospectively provided M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now