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Where is the Polish/Russian modern place name for "Zolosheen" quoted on a 1892 Naturalisation Certificate?

davidbohl

By davidbohl
in Interpreting documents

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davidbohl Brigadier General

davidbohl

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My chap Pte #51647 Alfred Morris 17/KLR has a father who was naturalised 1892 and was born in Zolesheen (?)

I know these borders are quite fluid but the nearest I can find is Zolochiv which is in downtown Ukraine.

Any other guesses please?

thanks

Dave

Screenshot2023-08-2816_06_02.png.2229d5b97e440ba90dd772c2cbc08103.png

 

 

 

 

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pierssc Lieutenant-Colonel

pierssc

Posted
Posted

Zalesin is very tempting, but it is west of Gdansk, and so never in "Russian Poland".  The same goes for Olsztyn, NNW of Warsaw, which was in East Prussia prior to WW1.  I'll keep looking...

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knittinganddeath Lieutenant-Colonel

knittinganddeath

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Could "Kovna" on the census be a misunderstanding of Rovno (now Rivne in Ukraine)?

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charlie2 Major-General

charlie2

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43 minutes ago, DavidOwen said:

so my money is on this one.

The problem being pre 1919 it was in Germany 

Charlie

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davidbohl Brigadier General

davidbohl

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1 hour ago, DavidOwen said:

Apologies if this is not the correct Arthur Morris.

Thanks, all we can stand down on Kovna 1921, his father died in 1904

MorrisAlf_fatherD1904.png.5b15d0a34ba846f79a51cc75e69ddef9.png

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pierssc Lieutenant-Colonel

pierssc

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, DavidOwen said:

Interestingly Sleszyn is in the same administrative district Gmina Zychlin so could also be a possibility Śleszyn - Wikipedia

Yes but like Zalesin and Olszyn (as I mentioned in post No.2) that was in Prussia too.

The map here is quite handy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Partition

Edited by pierssc
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pierssc Lieutenant-Colonel

pierssc

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To further confuse things, could "Poland" in 1892 have included areas that had been part of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth until annexed by Russia?  In which case we should maybe also be looking in Lithuania and Belarus. 

It all depends on what they meant by "Poland"....

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Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Lieut-General

Dai Bach y Sowldiwr

Posted
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18 hours ago, davidbohl said:

My chap Pte #51647 Alfred Morris 17/KLR has a father who was naturalised 1892 and was born in Zolesheen (?)

Is that form actually handwritten by Asquith himself?

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knittinganddeath Lieutenant-Colonel

knittinganddeath

Posted
Posted (edited)
19 hours ago, davidbohl said:

Zolochiv which is in downtown Ukraine.

??? There's a Zolochiv in Kharkiv oblast that used to be part of the Russian Empire.

Wondering if the -n ending on your document is a misreading of a sloppily written -v.

Edited by knittinganddeath
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pierssc Lieutenant-Colonel

pierssc

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55 minutes ago, DavidOwen said:

Not according to the entry for Zychlin - that states it was in Tsarist Russia at the time. Żychlin - Wikipedia

Hmm.... You're right.  I'm not so sure about that map now.  It doesn't take account of Warsaw going to Russia.

But as for Olszyn I'm getting it confused with Olsztyn - sorry.  Olsztyn - that seems to have definitely been in Prussian Poland, where it was known as Allenstein.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olsztyn

Olszyn on the other hand is much further east, a bit west of Brest, and that was in the Russian zone, which brings it back into the running on a phonetic basis.  It seems to be just a village and there doesn't seem to be much about it on the web apart from that very sparse Wikipedia entry.  There are however any number of hits for Olsztyn!

 

 

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davidbohl Brigadier General

davidbohl

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His dad was born 1856ish

Really detailed maps here https://www.abebooks.co.uk/maps/Polen-Kingdom-Poland-Warsaw-Krakow-1856/31139590959/bd#&gid=1&pid=1

This map has a place Sopoczyn in the SE corner https://www.abebooks.co.uk/maps/Polen-Kingdom-Poland-Warsaw-Krakow-1856/31139590959/bd#&gid=1&pid=2

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  • 3 weeks later...
Mikhail Second Lieutenant

Mikhail

Posted
Posted
On 29/08/2023 at 10:35, knittinganddeath said:

Could "Kovna" on the census be a misunderstanding of Rovno (now Rivne in Ukraine)?

Kovna (Kovno) - is a Kaunas (Lithuania) now.

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Mikhail Second Lieutenant

Mikhail

Posted
Posted
On 28/08/2023 at 18:20, davidbohl said:

My chap Pte #51647 Alfred Morris 17/KLR has a father who was naturalised 1892 and was born in Zolesheen (?)

I know these borders are quite fluid but the nearest I can find is Zolochiv which is in downtown Ukraine.

Any other guesses please?

thanks

Dave

Screenshot2023-08-2816_06_02.png.2229d5b97e440ba90dd772c2cbc08103.png

 

the town of Zoloshin was located in the Volyn province of the Russian Empire.

 

 

 

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FionaBam Major

FionaBam

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 29/08/2023 at 11:06, pierssc said:

 

 

Edited by FionaBam
Deleted my post as Not helpful to thread
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davidbohl Brigadier General

davidbohl

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7 hours ago, Mikhail said:

or maybe more correct, it's a town https://wiki2.org/en/Działoszyn , in Russian trascription Zoloshin.

Thanks Mikhail,

Działoszyn is certainly the best option we have had so far with it being in Poland and having a strong Jewish connection.

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Mikhail Second Lieutenant

Mikhail

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18 hours ago, davidbohl said:

Thanks Mikhail,

Działoszyn is certainly the best option we have had so far with it being in Poland and having a strong Jewish connection.

You're welcome! :)

 

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