Samuel (Uel) Stockdale

[hen190782]

Good Morning

I was recently sent the attached image of the above Samuel Stockdale from early 1920s by Gavin McCormick who says he was in the RUC or USC in the 1920s. Samuel Stockdale was born in County Tyrone in 1898. 

He appears to be wearing a British Army officers' tunic, although the Sam Browne belt is over the wrong shoulder (I think), with a grenade insignia on the lapels. The cap badge looks to be Royal Engineers. There are two medal ribbons and the second one might be for General Service Medal but the first one is indistinct. I cannot find medal entitlement for an officer in Royal Engineers called Samuel Stockdale, although he may have served after the war.

I would appreciate any help in identify the regiment and the medal ribbons.

Thanks 

Nigel 

Edited 2 March , 2023 by hen190782

[FROGSMILE]

13 hours ago, hen190782 said:

Good Morning

I was recently sent the attached image of the above Samuel Stockdale from early 1920s by Gavin McCormick who says he was in the RUC or USC in the 1920s.

He appears to be wearing a British Army officers' tunic, although the Sam Browne belt is over the wrong shoulder (I think), with a grenade insignia on the lapels. The cap badge looks to be Royal Engineers. There are two medal ribbons and the second one might be for General Service Medal but the first one is indistinct. I cannot find medal entitlement for an officer in Royal Engineers called Samuel Stockdale, although he may have served after the war.

I would appreciate any help in identify the regiment and the medal ribbons.

Thanks 

Nigel 

If you have a hard copy photo can you not use a magnifying lens to examine the cap badge.  It’s very blurred when viewed here and might even be a star shape.

The dark (but not black) buttons are relatively unusual and might perhaps be brown leather (rather like an old fashioned football In appearance), but again a magnifier might help confirm this.

Finally the collar badges do look rather like grenades, but without scrolls at base as were once required by TF officers.  He seems to be wearing a white shirt and dark tie that prewar had been an optional alternative to a drab shirt and tie when walking out.

Edited 2 March , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[hen190782]

1 minute ago, FROGSMILE said:

If you have a hard copy photo can you not use a magnifying lens to examine the cap badge.  It’s very blurred when viewed here and might even be a star shape.  The dark (but not black) buttons are relatively unusual and might perhaps be brown leather (rather like an old fashioned football In appearance), but again a magnifier might help confirm this.  Finally the collar badges do look rather like grenades, but without scrolls at base as were once required by TF officers.  He seeks to be wearing a white shirt and dark tie that prewar had been an optional alternative to a drab shirt and tie when walking out.

Thanks, unfortunately I do not have the original and am getting it second hand (and as a screengrab :-( ) ... and, believe me, this is a lot better than the the first image sent to me. The guy was born in 1898 and the photo is c1922.

[FROGSMILE]

2 minutes ago, hen190782 said:

Thanks, unfortunately I do not have the original and am getting it second hand (and as a screengrab :-( ) ... and, believe me, this is a lot better than the the first image sent to me. The guy was born in 1898 and the photo is c1922.

Unfortunately the photo isn’t clear enough to discern any detail beyond that which I’ve outlined so I’m afraid I can’t help.

Edited 2 March , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[hen190782]

1 minute ago, FROGSMILE said:

Unfortunately the photo isn’t clear enough to discern any detail beyond that which I’ve outlined so I’m afraid I can’t help.

Thank for taking the time to comment.

[Pat Atkins]

While the badge is heavily pixellated, the bottom (oddly) is slightly  less indistinct than the rest - looks like a star of some sort (Devonshire Regt, etc.) to me, rather than RE.

[FROGSMILE]

4 hours ago, Pat Atkins said:

While the badge is heavily pixellated, the bottom (oddly) is slightly  less indistinct than the rest - looks like a star of some sort (Devonshire Regt, etc.) to me, rather than RE.

I’m glad you can see a star shape too, but notably the collar badge is not a star so that rules out the Devon’s and the ASC.  It might be possible to narrow things down via elimination by comparing other regiments whose officers had a star shaped badge, e.g. Lincolnshire and compare the associated collar badge with the basic, albeit rather indistinct shape visible in the photo.

[Pat Atkins]

A perfunctory attempt using Google was pretty ineffectual, there are so many possibilities; I think this would need access to a proper reference book, and even then...

[FROGSMILE]

11 minutes ago, Pat Atkins said:

A perfunctory attempt using Google was pretty ineffectual, there are so many possibilities; I think this would need access to a proper reference book, and even then...

I’m not sure what you mean Pat.  There’s only a limited number of regiments whose officers wore a star shaped badge without any title scroll beneath. 

Edited 6 March , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[Pat Atkins]

True, I think I had a quick look and found nothing, then subsided into a state of lassitude! The perils of doing stuff in between other tasks.

 

[Michelle Young]

Size wise, it could be KEH, but what collar badges they wore, I don’t know. 

[FROGSMILE]

4 minutes ago, Michelle Young said:

Size wise, it could be KEH, but what collar badges they wore, I don’t know. 

The KEH didn’t have a star shaped badge Michelle and I thought that feature was agreed upon? 

[Michelle Young]

I’m not seeing the star, hence my comment! 

[FROGSMILE]

15 minutes ago, Pat Atkins said:

True, I think I had a quick look and found nothing, then subsided into a state of lassitude! The perils of doing stuff in between other tasks.

 

This is East Yorks. 

Edited 6 March , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]

2 minutes ago, Michelle Young said:

I’m not seeing the star, hence my comment! 

Ah I see.  Well, you’re right to consider cavalry regiments.  I still see the same as Pat, albeit very blurred.

[FROGSMILE]

18 minutes ago, Pat Atkins said:

True, I think I had a quick look and found nothing, then subsided into a state of lassitude! The perils of doing stuff in between other tasks.

 

How about Bermondsey Battalion, East Surrey Regiment?

[FROGSMILE]

Middlesex Yeomanry. 

Somerset Yeomanry. 

[Pat Atkins]

The star of the cap badge seems to have distinct rays and no scroll, but I'm not so sure now that isn't just a quirk of distortion; the collar dogs are unclear, at least to me (one of them looks like the Lothian & Border Horse!). So the fit of suitable cap badge and collar dogs is challenging, though perhaps not to an expert.,

[FROGSMILE]

1 hour ago, Pat Atkins said:

The star of the cap badge seems to have distinct rays and no scroll, but I'm not so sure now that isn't just a quirk of distortion; the collar dogs are unclear, at least to me (one of them looks like the Lothian & Border Horse!). So the fit of suitable cap badge and collar dogs is challenging, though perhaps not to an expert.,

Yes I agree that it’s a conundrum.

[FROGSMILE]

On 06/03/2023 at 20:46, Pat Atkins said:

The star of the cap badge seems to have distinct rays and no scroll, but I'm not so sure now that isn't just a quirk of distortion; the collar dogs are unclear, at least to me (one of them looks like the Lothian & Border Horse!). So the fit of suitable cap badge and collar dogs is challenging, though perhaps not to an expert.,

This one has been bugging me.  Assuming it is a star shaped badge and perhaps the scroll is tucked behind the chin strap (not uncommon), then another strong contender that might fit with the collar badge shape would be the Cheshire Regiment.

Edited 14 March , 2023 by FROGSMILE