Aveluy Wood Dressing Station

[IanG1916]

My Great grandad Charles Aquilla Butterworth 32064 was serving with the 13th Cheshire when he died on 26/08/1916, the war diary of the 13th Battalion shows they were in Thiepval Wood and on the 26/08/1916 came under enemy artillery fire at 5am, seriously wounded he was evacuated to a dressing station, according to the 25th Division ADMS diary the dressing station would be in dug outs at 57D Q 35 D 3 8 which I believe is the Lancashire Dump in Aveluy Wood, the Army Chaplain wrote home advising that he died in a dressing station at 9.30am after getting his name and address, he goes on to say he will be buried next to the dressing station and a cross erected. My grandad is commemorated on Thiepval Memorial but has no known grave but as they knew where he was buried why wouldn't he be mentioned that he is known to be buried in the cemetery of the dressing station, strange how his burial is unknown when they know where he was buried, 5 Cheshires died that day and all 5 have no known grave, if anyone has any more information on records that may of existed for burials I would be grateful information.

[Cheshire22]

1 hour ago, IanG1916 said:

My Great grandad Charles Aquilla Butterworth 32064 was serving with the 13th Cheshire when he died on 26/08/1916, the war diary of the 13th Battalion shows they were in Thiepval Wood and on the 26/08/1916 came under enemy artillery fire at 5am, seriously wounded he was evacuated to a dressing station, according to the 25th Division ADMS diary the dressing station would be in dug outs at 57D Q 35 D 3 8 which I believe is the Lancashire Dump in Aveluy Wood, the Army Chaplain wrote home advising that he died in a dressing station at 9.30am after getting his name and address, he goes on to say he will be buried next to the dressing station and a cross erected. My grandad is commemorated on Thiepval Memorial but has no known grave but as they knew where he was buried why wouldn't he be mentioned that he is known to be buried in the cemetery of the dressing station, strange how his burial is unknown when they know where he was buried, 5 Cheshires died that day and all 5 have no known grave, if anyone has any more information on records that may of existed for burials I would be grateful information.

.

 

[TEW]

The most likely explanation is that during the fighting for Aveluy April-Aug 1918 the cemetery & grave markers were shelled etc.

There were post armistice additions and concentrations added on 1923. There are 172 unknowns buried there and a special memorial to another 20 known to be buried somewhere within the cemetery.

To try to ID a grave for Butterworth you'd have to access all the burial registration, concentrations and the special memorial/s for the cemetery.

TEW

 

 

 

[jay dubaya]

6 hours ago, IanG1916 said:

My Great grandad Charles Aquilla Butterworth 32064 was serving with the 13th Cheshire when he died on 26/08/1916, the war diary of the 13th Battalion shows they were in Thiepval Wood and on the 26/08/1916 came under enemy artillery fire at 5am, seriously wounded he was evacuated to a dressing station, according to the 25th Division ADMS diary the dressing station would be in dug outs at 57D Q 35 D 3 8 which I believe is the Lancashire Dump in Aveluy Wood, the Army Chaplain wrote home advising that he died in a dressing station at 9.30am after getting his name and address, he goes on to say he will be buried next to the dressing station and a cross erected. My grandad is commemorated on Thiepval Memorial but has no known grave but as they knew where he was buried why wouldn't he be mentioned that he is known to be buried in the cemetery of the dressing station, strange how his burial is unknown when they know where he was buried, 5 Cheshires died that day and all 5 have no known grave, if anyone has any more information on records that may of existed for burials I would be grateful information.

23443 Henry Thomas is also noted as having DoW on that day and he too is remembered at Thiepval. Is there a visual record of the Chaplain's letter? 

It can't be assumed that the dressing station was at Lancashire Dump, I don't doubt that he may have been buried here but a broader search is worth considering. Mesnil Dressing Station was in use at this time and was later concentrated to Mesnil Communal Cemetery Extension. I too suspect that his grave was lost as TEW mentions above and likely before it was a registered grave which perhaps suggests an eariler period for its loss.

I have the Grave Registration Report Forms (GRRF) and the Concentration of Graves - Burial Returns (CoG-BR) for the 2 cemeteries - PM me an email address if you'd like copies. A quick scan through Lancashire Dump reveals only 1 unknown Cheshire - a post war concentration recovered with T/7 shoulder titles which may date this casualty to 1918, I'll have a better look later...

[TEW]

Butterworth also has an unusual sequence of official Casualty List entries.

22/9/16. Wounded.

26/12/16. Previously Reported Wounded, Now Reported Wounded and Missing.

14/6/17. Previously Reported Wounded and Missing, Now Reported Died of Wounds.

From the above it would seem that any record of his death and burial at a dressing station in Aug 1916 was not reported correctly.

TEW

 

[IanG1916]

 

I have looked at other dressing stations but the only Cheshires from around the date he died were originally buried in Paisley avenue and moved to Lonsdale cemetery so were these killed without evacuation to a dressing station, the evacuation route from Thiepval that week only shows 2 advanced dressing stations and i think ordere were that those who were likely to die would not be moved to the main dressing station which is listed as Forceville but there are no unknowns in that cemetery, I know its a long shot but would be nice to have a likely place hes buried, the only clue is that he reached a dressing station

 

[BillyH]

W/397 Theodore Wright (13th Bn) also died of wounds on 26th August and I believe his wounds were received the previous day. He is buried in Puchevillers British Cemetery and so although it is a long shot it might be worth checking out this cemetery for unknowns?

Incidentally, the chaplain J.D.Hepple wrote to Theodore Wright's parents, is this the same chaplain who wrote to Butterworth's family?

BillyH.

[TEW]

Does the 25th Division ADMS diary give any indication as to how the two ADSs were used?

Normally they would give details for EG. Left battalions to ADS #1, Right Battalions to ADS #2. Using the infantry diaries you should be able to ID which group the 13th Cheshires fell into.

It's still odd to me that three months after the newspaper account of his death he was reported missing and eventually reported DOW 10 months later.

One would think there would have been a lot of correspondence between the wife and the Cheshire's records office as she would have been receiving telegrams from the office reporting him being missing months after the newspaper account.

TEW

[IanG1916]

Hi Billy 

 

I looked at Puchevillers but as its a clearing station did not look much further, but will have a look. not sure on the Chaplain, any family members that may have known are long gone and I only found out about my great grandad a couple of years ago, he was never mentioned and the WW1 never discussed. I have been given a fagment of a mirror he used for shaving, I know of alot of this is guesswork but just trying to have a best guess really where he may of ended up.

[IanG1916]

Hi Tew the evac instructions are from the right, the left instructions are for Mailly and Bertrancourt which seems too far left for Thiepval Wood

[TEW]

Do you mean the right battalions would have been evacuated to the dug outs in Q.35.D and the left battalions to Black Horse Bridge?

Are there other battalions involved in the right sector that would also have been evacuated to Q.35.D? EG. 11th Lancashire Fusiliers, are any of those buried at Aveluy Wood who died in the same period?

I have no idea how many 13th Cheshires were wounded that day but presumably some were evacuated to base hospitals and may have surviving records. One casualty form B.103 in a surviving record could tie a 13th Cheshire man to a particular dressing station for the 26th Aug.

TEW

[IanG1916]

The right battalions used the Lancashire dump from around Thiepval wood as there was a tramway I believe, Black horse Bridge seems to have been used from further right near Authuille Wood, the left battalions were further north near Mailly Maillet from the coordinates but stand to be corrected, on the 26th there were 5 Cheshire's killed and 14 wounded but as he wasn't killed outright not sure which category he would of been listed under, cant see any other 25th Division at Lancashire dump in that time frame either but any that are in known graves were buried originally at Paisley avenue, the wounded option is a good path but not too sure how to follow any of the wounded who were shipped back. Maybe the dressing station was an aid post within Thiepval Wood and he was concentrated into Lonsdale or Connaught cemetery's

[TEW]

I'd suggest downloading the II Corps DDMS diary WO95/658/4. Also same for 75th Field Ambulance WO95/2239/1. Both need some checking through.

Your 25th ADMS Medical Arrangements extract may be out of date by 26th Aug.

There's an entry that reads roughly : 24/8/16, Due to shelling etc. of the nearby dump the ADS in dug outs will move to the cellars of the Chateau at Aveluy.

There's another order dated 26/8/16 that places the ADSs of 25th Division at:

Lancaster Dump, formerly known as Aveluy Wood. 57d.Q.35.D 2.8

Black Horse Bridge 57d.W.5.b.8.1

Aveluy Post 57d.W.11.B.4.3

And a collecting post at Paisley Avenue 57d.Q.30.c.8.4.

None of the above in cellars of the Chateau!

There are a lot of changes for the 25th Division around 26th August. They only arrived in II Corps 15/8/16. There are changes to the divisional front lines with 25th/49th divisions handing over dressing stations on the 26th Aug.

TEW

[IanG1916]

Thanks Tew I will have a look at DDMS diary, I already have the 75th Field Ambulance and it says Martinsart dressing station had been shelled and moved, the 25th Division swapped over to the 49th West Riding Division on the 26/08/16 and their arrangements are very similar, thanks for your help