Capt. Percy William Norman Fraser, 2 Cameron Highlanders: KiA 23 February 1915.

[rolt968]

I starting to research Captain Percy William Norman Fraser. He was a regular officer killed on 23 February 1915. There appears to be no Officer's Record at the National Archives. There is MRIC. However it looks as if his medals were not requested so it has virtually no information.

He seems to have had an interesting prewar career.  Can anyone please explain one or two entries in the Army Lists (and other sources):

• In the 1906.1907 and 1908 Hart's Army Lists he is listed as 2nd Battalion (which was at Pretoria) but there is a note in italics; “in charge Musketry Duties”. Can anyone tell me what he was actually doing and where he was doing it?
• In October 1908 he was part of the "Legation Guard, Pekin" and unable to attend his father's funeral. (2 Cameron Highlanders was at Tientsin.) I'm mare than a bit vague about this. Presumably the arrangements made aftr the Boxer Rising.
• In the 1914 Hart's Army List he is was still an officer of 2 Cameron Highlanders but he was serving as "Capt[ain] 3rd Battalion". Presumably he was attached to the Special Reserve battalion and that "captain" in this case was an appointment? since he held the rank of captain.
• He went to France with 2 Battalion (which had come back to the UK from India) on 20 December 1914. At fisrt I was a little surprised that he was called into 1 Cameron Highlanders when it went to France. Presumably 1 Cameron Highlanders had a full complement of officers.

Thank you in advance.

RM

 

[TullochArd]

DSO (26.06.02) and plenty more ...............

Edited 2 November , 2022 by TullochArd

[rolt968]

13 minutes ago, TullochArd said:

DSO and plenty more ...............

I said he had an interesting prewar career. DSO (Boer War), both South Africa Medals, Egypt Medal and Khedive's Medal. I'm not sure about the second from the left (Coronation Medal perhaps?) He also got a Mention.

Edited 2 November , 2022 by rolt968

[TullochArd]

10 hours ago, rolt968 said:

DSO (Boer War), both South Africa Medals, Egypt Medal and Khedive's Medal. I'm not sure about the second from the left (Coronation Medal perhaps?) 

I believe the MiD you mention preceded, and was associated with, the DSO. 

The medal second from the left is not a coronation medal as these don't have clasps.  It was awarded for service in Somaliland 1903/04, specifically at the action at Ind Galli, which entitled him to the AGSM and two clasps. 

The last medal is the Khedive's Sudan medal and as a foreign award, although awarded at the same time as the Queen's Sudan medal, is placed last under the order of precedence rules.  His Khedive's Sudan medal appears to have no clasps which is rather unusual but not unheard of. 

We know he also received the Delhi Durbar medal which is not shown on this photo so the photo likely dates between 1905 >1910-ish. 

Regarding “in charge Musketry Duties” ...... this is likely some form of management appointment connected with shooting skills ...... I suspect akin to a modern-day training officer. 

Agreed, his MIC is curiously blank.

Edited 3 November , 2022 by TullochArd

[rolt968]

18 minutes ago, TullochArd said:

I believe the MiD you mention preceded, and was associated with, the DSO. 

The medal second from the left is not a coronation medal as these don't have clasps.  It was awarded for service in Somaliland 1903/04, specifically at the action at Ind Galli, which entitled him to the AGSM and two clasps. 

The last medal is the Khedive's Sudan medal and as a foreign award, although awarded at the same time as the Queen's Sudan medal, is placed last under the order of precedence rules.  His Khedive's Sudan medal appears to have no clasps which is rather unusual but not unheard of. 

We know he also received the Delhi Durbar medal which is not shown on this photo so the photo likely dates between 1905 >1910-ish. 

Regarding “in charge Musketry Duties” ...... this is likely some form of management appointment regarding shooting skills ...... I suspect akin to a modern-day training officer. 

His MIC is curiously blank isn't it.

I forgot about Somaliland! I hadn't thought about his receiving a Dehli Durbar Medal. I really should have - he was at Bangalore at the time of the 1911 Census.

Is there any way of knowing where the musketry appointment was? He seems to have spent a lot of time away from his battalion.

The MIC is certainly blank. I have been assuming that his relatives didn't request the medals, but in that case would there have been a MIC at all. It's interesting that there seems to be no surviving officer's file. (The second regular officer killed early in the war for whom I have found no surviving officer's file.)

His family are also interesting. His father was a HEIC/ Indian (Bengal) Army (born in 1826) and a Mutiny veteran.

Edited 2 November , 2022 by rolt968

[TullochArd]

On 02/11/2022 at 21:27, rolt968 said:

"He seems to have spent a lot of time away from his battalion........."

".........The MIC is certainly blank. I have been assuming that his relatives didn't request the medals, but in that case would there have been a MIC at all. It's interesting that there seems to be no surviving officer's file. (The second regular officer killed early in the war for whom I have found no surviving officer's file.)"

 

Yes.  He certainly got some unusually high-profile jobs immediately after commissioning: Hamilton's ADC and a Staff Lieutenant on Kitchener's staff .......not to mention his 'special service' job in Somaliland.  His ADC job likely explains why, although a Cameron Highlander, he didn't get the usual 1 CAMERON Khedive’s Sudan two clasps ‘The Atbara’ and ‘Khartoum’. (Hamilton was also a Cameron Highlander, but judging by the photo below, he seems to have got two clasps) After 1906 things settle down and he is with 2 CAMERONS (only formed on paper in 1897) in China and India India until the War.

Something I'll let you get on with Rolt: The Camerons regimental magazines (79th News) have all been uploaded by the regimental museum and can be trawled through at:

Queen’s Own Cameron Highlanders – Museum Magazines

That might reveal what the 3 CAMERONS mention just before the War relates to. 

You will have seen ‘14.8.22.’ on the MIC and a reference ‘NW/6/22877’ on the front. The back of MIC is blank.  This likely connects us to another file. I wonder if there might be an India Office connection somewhere as the issuing authority?

Edited 4 November , 2022 by TullochArd

[rolt968]

1 hour ago, TullochArd said:

 

Yes.  He certainly got some unusually high-profile jobs immediately after commissioning: Hamilton's ADC and a Staff Lieutenant on Kitchener's staff .......not to mention his 'special service' job in Somaliland.  His ADC job likely explains why, although a Cameron Highlander, he didn't get the usual 1 CAMERON Khedive’s Sudan two clasps ‘The Atbara’ and ‘Khartoum’. (Hamilton was also a Cameron Highlander) After 1906 things settle down and he is with 2 CAMERONS (only formed on paper in 1897) in China and India India until the War.

Something I'll let you get on with Rolt: The Camerons regimental magazines (79th News) have all been uploaded by the regimental museum and can be trawled through at:

Queen’s Own Cameron Highlanders – Museum Magazines

That might reveal what the 3 CAMERONS mention just before the War relates to. 

You will have seen ‘14.8.22.’ on the MIC and a reference ‘NW/6/22877’ on the front. The back of MIC is blank.  This likely connects us to another file. I wonder if there might be an India Office connection somewhere as the issuing authority?

Thank you very much. The link to the 79th News is very valuable. It makes very interesting reading on its own! (I have just got to a report of men shooting on a range who managed (by accident) to kill a dog and a pedigree bull!)

I had not thought about an India Office connection. I had wondered if it refered to a late application, but 1922 wasn't late. I will need to look who the executor was. I would have thought that the most likely applicant for the medals would have been his brother who was regular officer in the Seaforths.

RM

Edited 4 November , 2022 by rolt968