Map Ref. Abb. I. 2

[Daniel DUFOUR]

I'm looking for the map IWM refers to as "Map Ref. Abb. I. 2". Can anyone help? IWM has photos with this reference in Conchil-le-Temple. For example, this photo photograph | Imperial War Museums (iwm.org.uk) where "C.100" appears in the bottom right. Does "C.100" indicate a more specific area in the referenced map?

[TEW]

My thoughts would be that 'Abb' is an Abbeville sheet with 'I.2' as the square reference.

However, the coverage of 1:40,000 maps I'm familiar with would not be able to show Abbeville and Conchil on one sheet.

Perhaps it's a larger scale map of the rear area based around Abbeville

The 'C 100' could be the photographer's means of ID or a former IWM accession number.

TEW

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

Neither Abbeville nor Conchil are areas covered by the standard British trench map series, so the co-ordinates on the photograph are probably not what we associate with that series.

[WhiteStarLine]

Both actually were covered by British trench maps but these are rarely seen (I had to dig).  Abbeville is Sheet 57f square L.16.  Conchil-le-Temple is Sheet 44d Square V.22.

Image courtesy The Western Front Association:

[Daniel DUFOUR]

Hey guys, thanks so much for helping! I'll go see these maps!

[Daniel DUFOUR]

39 minutes ago, WhiteStarLine said:

Both actually were covered by British trench maps but these are rarely seen (I had to dig).  Abbeville is Sheet 57f square L.16.  Conchil-le-Temple is Sheet 44d Square V.22.

Image courtesy The Western Front Association:

Where can I find these maps?

[Daniel DUFOUR]

59 minutes ago, Daniel DUFOUR said:

Where can I find these maps?

I'm searching Western Front maps (i'm a registered user) where I can find sheet 57F but not 44D, which is the one I need...

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

2 hours ago, WhiteStarLine said:

Both actually were covered by British trench maps but these are rarely seen (I had to dig). 

That's interesting. They aren't on the McMaster index. Where  do they reside?

[TEW]

1 hour ago, Daniel DUFOUR said:

I'm searching Western Front maps (i'm a registered user) where I can find sheet 57F but not 44D, which is the one I need...

44d is the one showing Conchil but it doesn't correspond to your Abb. I. 2 reference as Conchil lies in square V.

Perhaps Abb is not an abbreviation of Abbeville as I thought. If it is there must have been another larger scale map covering both places where Conchil sits in square I.2.

I don't know who took the photo or how IWM ended up with it and who/when wrote the (slightly odd) caption but it may not actually be at Conchil or the map ref might be wrong.

TEW

[WhiteStarLine]

22 hours ago, Daniel DUFOUR said:

I'm searching Western Front maps (i'm a registered user) where I can find sheet 57F but not 44D, which is the one I need...

@Daniel DUFOUR Daniel, I've just made a direct download link which I will PM you.  If  @Dai Bach y Sowldiwr or @TEW want a copy just PM me.

These are not McMaster maps but IWM maps - published under license by The Western Front Association's TrenchMapper.  There are over 10,000 maps / aerial photo montages of which 5,250 have been georeferenced.  In theory, maps that have not yet been georeferenced can be found with the Advanced Search.  In practice, this map has absolutely zero recorded metadata so a keyword search will not find it.  I only found it by doing a trawl on 57f and 44d.

Cheers, Bill

[TEW]

Yes please. I'm sat here trying to find 57f & 44d. Good timing.

TEW

[TEW]

Looking at IWM photos and following on the sequence from Q 47362 which is the Conchil Abb. I.2 reference you arrive at Q 47364 which is of Authie Exchange Station but has the same reference of Abb. I.2.

Conchil and Authie can't really have the same map reference so it's more than likely it's just identifying the Map sheet.

TEW

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

@WhiteStarLine Thanks for the offer, but I was only interested in where these could actually be  found.

With regards to the McMaster collection, you are saying that there are maps outside the limits of their grid?:

 

Edited 21 October , 2022 by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr

[WhiteStarLine]

9 hours ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said:

there are maps outside the limits of their grid?

Hi DByS,

Yes indeed.  The McMaster collection is a wonderful representation of the main areas fought over by the British Army.  However, the same mapping technique was extended to administrative areas, training areas etc,  The Lines of Communication extract below is itself only a portion.  It continues 40km north and at least 60 km east.  The River Schelde flows through Antwerp on Sheet 15 from square D.13 to J.25.

The same map coverage was used in the UK and called the Artillery Training series.  Greenwich Observatory is on the Woolwich map at A.20 while Bath is in square B.19 of the Bath  map.

Click to enlarge this map.

Cheers, Bill

Courtesy The Western Front Association

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

Thank you WSL,

That is an excellent index map. I've never seen that detail anywhere before.

[Daniel DUFOUR]

Thanks guys for the great help!