Pattern 14 Ammo Pouch

[Fromelles]

Picked this up today, sorry about the quality of the pics. Would anyone have any idea as to the Unit markings? I think it reads: No 2 GC COY 17

Also, I cannot make out what looks to be the makers mark, it looks to me like it could be: JAS___ or maybe JASS___ - my son's younger eyes couldn't make out anything more either

I don't collect Pattern 14 equipment, but it was being sold as a 'Sam Browne' pouch and was priced as such so I couldn't look the other way.

Your thoughts would be appreciated

Dan

Edited 1 August , 2022 by Fromelles

[FROGSMILE]

It’s a P14 pistol ammunition pouch, as issued to Tank Corps and MGC personnel armed with a Webley.  Also used by other corps SNCOs and WOII similarly equipped, including some infantry appointments.  Might the marking refer to GG rather than GC?

Edited 1 August , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[Fromelles]

I doubt it's GG, the second letter looks like it's a 'C', if anything it could be 'CC', but still think it's 'GC'

[FROGSMILE]

4 minutes ago, Fromelles said:

I doubt it's GG, the second letter looks like it's a 'C', if anything it could be 'CC', but still think it's 'GC'

Understood.  As the letters are usually impressed (stamped in) I just wondered if it might have been uneven on one side.  There’s no obvious unit relating to GC that I can think of.  If it were GG then Grenadier Guards.  They had numbered rather than lettered companies.

Edited 1 August , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[Grovetown]

59 minutes ago, Fromelles said:

Picked this up today, sorry about the quality of the pics. Would anyone have any idea as to the Unit markings? I think it reads: No 2 GC COY 17

Also, I cannot make out what looks to be the makers mark, it looks to me like it could be: JAS___ or maybe JASS___ - my son's younger eyes couldn't make out anything more either

I don't collect Pattern 14 equipment, but it was being sold as a 'Sam Browne' pouch and was priced as such so I couldn't look the other way.

Your thoughts would be appreciated

Dan

 

 

 

I had one like this and the more complete marking is Jas Dawson & Son.

Cheers,

GT.

[FROGSMILE]

“James Dawson was born in Welton near Lincoln in 1836. He moved to Sheffield in the mid-1850s and was making boots and shoes, employing 4 men. James married Mary Skelton at St George's, Sheffield in 1858. By 1868 he was back in Lincoln selling boots and shoes at 15 Sincil Street. 

1880 he recognised the need for leather belts for all the machinery that was being manufactured in Lincoln and other places in the UK. He formed a company with Walter, his son, and William Posnett, the belting works opened at Unity Square in the same year. The company grew rapidly.  In 1881 a Dawson belt was shown at the Lincolnshire Show 2ft 4in (0.71 metres) by 60 ft (18.3 metres), weighing 3 cwt (152 Kg)

Dawsons gained a "First Order of Merit" in 1887 at the Adelaide Jubilee Exhibition for Leather machine belting, over the years there were many other awards for their belting. The Belting works moved from Unity Square to New Boultham about 1890.

The  company was incorporated as a private limited company on 10th March 1896 with a capital of £70,000 in £10 shares, becoming James Dawson & Son Ltd.  Walter left the company and became a farmer, and another son, George, became managing director.  James Dawson senior retire in 1902 and died on 24th April 1912, Sadly George died in March 1912. Following the deaths of his father and brother, James became managing director, he was chairman of the company from 1922.  James, his son and a grandson of the founder, became managing director.

Dawsons had large contracts during World War One for infantry equipment and other war material.

Dawsons have always been a major employer in Lincoln and today are Lincoln's second-largest employer. Of all the manufacturing companies established in Lincoln in the 19th century, Dawson's is the only one that retains its original name.”

Edited 1 August , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[Fromelles]

That's great fellas, cheers

Now to figure out what the Unit marking is

Dan 

[Dave66]

Certainly looks to read GC, so could it be a cavalry unit?…the Indians had a guides cavalry according to this….https://cdn.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documents/records/abbreviations-in-world-war-one-medal-index-cards-unit.pdf

Dave.

[4thGordons]

1 hour ago, Dave66 said:

Certainly looks to read GC, so could it be a cavalry unit?…the Indians had a guides cavalry according to this….https://cdn.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documents/records/abbreviations-in-world-war-one-medal-index-cards-unit.pdf

Dave.

Skennerton (The Broad Arrow) gives the abbreviation for the Indian Queens Own Corps of Guides Cavalry  as C.G.C. (p134)

I just had a fairly careful look through  Skennerton's lists and while there are quite a lot of CG I didn't find any GC and I agree that it does look to be  GC!

Chris

 

[FROGSMILE]

The Guides Cavalry, like all cavalry, were organised in Troops until 1890 and then Squadrons (by merging troops in pairs).  The pouch is marked with COY, which is usually an abbreviation (one of two) for company.  It’s with that factor in mind that I’d ruled them out of any mention.  I cannot recall any unit, with companies, that was abbreviated as GC.

Edited 2 August , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[Fromelles]

Thank you all, I was thinking Cavalry too, but couldn't see why they'd be using P14 equipment

I also gave Canada a go, but don't know enough about them to be confident 

I also thought maybe it's been mis-stamped, a GG C becoming a GC C, but that can't be proven

So the search continues.....

Dan

[Fromelles]

The only other piece of P14 equipment I own is also an ammo pouch. 

I hadn't noticed before, it also has a makers mark and date, but again I cannot make it out. I'll try and get better pics of the markings once I get a little more time.

They both have seen very little use, if any at all. 

Dan