Another Mark I tank "identified" - Chaos II - in French archive film

[delta]

One of our researchers, Sue Chifney, has found a six minute film of Mark I tanks in the French archives

https://imagesdefense.gouv.fr/fr/chars-anglais-de-type-mark-chaos-ii-et-centurio.html

The first tank to be seen (albeit in thick mist) is not identified  elsewhere - a male from C Company  named Chaos II.   Sadly the manufacturer's serial number is not visible. 

Edited 16 July , 2022 by delta
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[stripeyman]

Most interesting, note the tail wheels on Centurio have broken off, not dismantled.

[delta]

We think her commander was Alec Arnaud - if this is so, she was Male tank no 722 which ditched in a shell hole on the deployment to Ginchy on 14'/15 Sep.  The damage possibly occurred whilst extracting her. 

 

[johntaylor]

Hi, this is fascinating footage - as you say the manufacturer's number is not visible on the first tank (Chaos II), but the second tank does have a number visible at around 5 mins 38 secs - the second number looks like '2' but the others are unclear. I think there's an 'S' before the name of the second tank and a last letter covered in mud, so the full name should be "H.M.L.S. Centurion".

There seem to be lots of French soldiers watching and moving around, and the fact that this footage appears in French archives suggest it was shot by one of their cameramen. I wonder if this simply reflects the location, which was close to the French sector on the Somme, or if there was something else going on - the tanks were obviously near a quite large encampment/transportation hub, and the shots at around 3 mins 30 secs look like an informal trench-crossing demonstration, perhaps to impress our Allies.

Not sure what all this signifies, but thanks for highlighting this amazing discovery!

John

 

 

[delta]

Stills from the Centurion images have been found  in a French album.  It gives the location as Bronfay Farm and the date as 29 September - on this date, C Company tanks were withdrawing back to the Loop Railhead. 

On 1st October, the following Male tanks were listed as being at the Loop: 705, 740, 741, 746, 760 and 722; one of our researcher has identified Lt Alec Arnaud guiding Centurion in the film and Arnaud commanded 722 on 15 and 25 Sep.

I think we can accept that Centurion was 722. 

 

 

 

 

Edited 17 July , 2022 by delta

[pjwmacro]

Great work alcon.

[johntaylor]

I presume this is the manufacturer's number on the film, though it's hard to be certain and even harder to make it out. However 722 is certainly a possibility. Excellent that you've also worked out the location.

All the best,

John

 

 

[stripeyman]

Is there any history on these two tanks? I have searched all I have and cannot find anything.

[delta]

Centurion  ditched in a large shell hole as she deployed on 15  September and did not get into action. The tank was recovered and again allocated to the Guards Division on 25 September but was not deployed. Centurion was photographed at Bronfay Farm on 29 September , without a steering tail, after all tanks were ordered to return to their Base at the Loop railgead and 1 October was reported as being at the Loop. In the middle of October she was part of Capt Inglis'section  south of the River Ancre but there is no other record afterwards.

Chaos  is wholly unknown 

 

 

 

Edited 31 July , 2022 by delta

[stripeyman]

Thank you for the information. 

[delta]

Another, slightly sharper, image of Centurion - this time from a French armoured vehicle company website

https://www.arquus-defense.com/fr/premiere-utilisation-du-char-dassaut-lors-de-la-bataille-de-la-somme?fbclid=IwAR3dVtWksT2KuJmle0IaOO2jqrZeOAaXXkGD87_u_GUojG3G77rpqNMK1Rw

The front horn is clearly visible but there is no sing of a serial number