My great grandfather was a stoker,he did 29 years on the ships.

[In search of history]

I had a discussion with my very ill grandfather last year,about his history and he told me that his date rwas a petty stoker in the navy,such amazing stories,unfortunately my grandfather passed away before I could find out anymore about his dad.

 

He did manage to send me original service records,

I would love to find out a bit more about the ships he was on and where they were during his time on them.....

 

Dunno if anyone can help or point me in the right direction

[PRC]

Hi @In search of history and welcome to the forum.

A name and service number would be a good place to start, or if you don't wish to give those a listing of vessels served with and dates.

I'm sure it won't be an issue as you are talking about someone three generation of ancestors back, but the forum is dedicated to the Great War of 1914-18, so he would need to have served for at least some of that period. Admins will normally be fairly lenient as long as the core of the thread is great war related.

Cheers,
Peter

[In search of history]

Hi PRC,thanks for that

His name is Joseph henry hall,born 1892.

I'll upload a picture of his service records

As far as I can tell his first post was on hms victory in 1910,I assumed he was discharged,as it says in Jan 1940 he is unfit for naval service..

 

I think his number was 7682

Edited 19 June , 2022 by In search of history

[DavidOwen]

Moved to Sailors sub forum as more appropriate.

[In search of history]

Aah OK many thanks

[In search of history]

I've just found these stashed on my memory card

His cap band says hms anthony

We have more documents and the medals he was awarded too

[RNCVR]

Well I can tell you from his service parchment (what I am able to read of it) he might have had service in submarines from 16 Oct 1915 to 11 July 1916, serving first at HMS Dolphin (sub training depot & base), Sub depot ships Maidstone & Titania.  No subs are show in brackets beside either of these ships so he may have been ships company & not actually on subs, but it is possible he did his initial sub training when first drafted to Dolphin. List 13 means he was ships company, permanent & supernumerary ratings borne in addition to the ships complement.  He appears to have returned to General Service (surface fleet) when drafted to Victory 12 July 1916.

Prior to that he served on HMS Nubian - a Destroyer of 1909) from 1 Sep 1914 to 15 Oct '15. It appears as if her Flotilla parent/depot ship was HMS Attentive.

After he returned to General Service he was on HMS Inconstant (Light Cruiser of 1914) from 11 Aug '16 to 24 May '17.  Then back to bases Victory & Vivid, the next entry at the fold in the parchment I am unable to make out.

His top rate was Stoker 1st class, not a Stoker Petty Officer.

In July 0f 1922 he was transferred to the RFR (Royal Fleet Reserve) & he appears to have taken part in regular drills from then onwards until release from the RFR on 4 Jan 1933.

Being recalled for 2WW (as a Stoker 1st cl) he saw service on HMS Anthony (Destroyer of 1929) 23 Aug '39 to 31 Jan '40 when he was declared "Physically Unfit for Naval service"

He should have medals for 1WW (a 1914-15 star trio at least - he rec'd War Service chevrons for 1914 thru 1918.) & possibly 2WW. & those might be noted on the other side of he service parchment.

[PRC]

1 hour ago, In search of history said:

I think his number was 7682

The National Archive research guide fron Royal Navy ratings shows that men who enlisted as Stokers between 1908 and 1923 had the prefix K - so in this case K7682.

I don't know if it will help our naval afficianados, but I've cropped the first page downloaded from the TNA and darkened the highlights.

Image courtesy The National Archive.

Seems to have had one or two discipline issues. Looks like he had a spell on submarines from February to July 1916, serving aboard the G5. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_G5

From a post on another forum - "After commissioning, she was sent to join 11th Submarine Flotilla at Blyth and spent the whole of the First World War conducting war patrols from there. She made her first of her 39 war patrols in April 1916. In July 1916, she rescued the 29 survivors from three trawlers which had been sunk by a U-Boat. "
https://kenthistoryforum.com/index.php?topic=303.0

https://www.agefotostock.com/age/en/details-photo/british-submarine-hms-g5/MEV-10837234

From December 1917 to March 1919 he was serving aboard the Armoured Cruiser Achilles. A transcript of her shipslogs to December 1918 can be found here:- http://www.naval-history.net/OWShips-WW1-05-HMS_Achilles.htm

Image courtesy of the Library of Congress. Restriction on re-use applies.

Hope that gets you started,

Peter

 

 

[In search of history]

Wow,thanks chaps,that's an amazing start!!

I've just uploaded a photo of him and his trio of medals

 

 

Thanks so much

[RNCVR]

I see from the ADM 188 (much easier to read) you have just posted (as I was typing my response) that he indeed had service on Subs whilst on HMS Titania - Sub G5.

His 1WW trio is mounted in the wrong order (presumably how he wore them) - the 1914-15 star should be on the left followed by the silver War & bronze Victory medals. 

I would have thought he should also have qualified for the RFR LS medal as well, but apparently not unless it became separated from his war medals. Hall should also have at least a War medal for his 2WW service.

[In search of history]

Brilliant,I will have to ask some question about the rest of his medals,unfortunately they are in Spain so i can't actually get them yet

[RNCVR]

OK, so after looking over his ADM 188 its pretty obvious his conduct was not up to standard - he had cell time, hard labour for 90 days - breakout (of ship), & 21 days detention for absence.   So no RFR LS medal for Hall.

[In search of history]

Yeah I did see that,I wonder what he could've done do deserve that

[RNCVR]

It is quite possible Hall was returned to General Service (from Subs) due to his Cell time whilst serving on Sub G5. The Sub service was pretty strict about unsuitable candidates service in subs.

[In search of history]

So from what you can see,did he get discharged for medical reaso s or was it just his age?

[RNCVR]

Well Hall obviously had some serious conduct issues, Detention in that time was not a pleasant experience & Hard Labour was just that, he must have committed a serious offence  Breakout means basically he deserted (likely punished by Warrant) to serve 90 days HL. But not serious enough to have been discharged as Unsuitable or SNLR (Services No Longer Required) by the RN.

[RNCVR]

 

So from what you can see,did he get discharged for medical reasons or was it just his age?

Possibly his age, however he was declared he Physically (Medically) Unfit for Naval Service for some reason.   He was getting on in age (48) for active service so perhaps age was a factor.  Service on the North Atlantic at that age in a Destroyer is not easy service during winter months (as he was) by any means. 

 

Edited 19 June , 2022 by RNCVR

[In search of history]

Thank you so much,this is absolutely amazingSo from what you can see,did he get discharged for medical reaso s or was it just his age?

[RaySearching]

Reason for discharge in 1940

[In search of history]

Oh wow so neck trouble!

That's interesting,he,my grandad and both my uncle and father are all under 6 ft,my younger brother is under 6 foot,I'm 6 foot 4 and have always had neck and back issues

[RNCVR]

 

PUNS - "Physically Unfit for Naval Seervice"

Thanks Ray - makes sense at Hall's age, he must have been in a fair amount of pain all of the time & sea service would certainly have aggravated that.

I know, I suffer from Osteo Arthritis in my neck & lower back & I am considerably older than Hall.

In Search of History - do you know when Hall passed away?  & why?

 

Edited 19 June , 2022 by RNCVR

[In search of history]

I'm not sure,but could probably find out

I'm currently off work with a slipped disc in lumbar spine,sciatica and just generally not in a great way

[In search of history]

Also I've just remembered my step fathers father was in the desert rats in 2ww

[PRC]

Pardon the nautical “PUNS”, but being a landlubber I’m a bit out of my depth here,

In trying to make a bit more sense of it for myself, is this a fair summary from the ADM188 of his Great War Service.

All as Stoker 1

5th May 1914 to 31st August 1914.
HMS Excellent.

1st September 1914 to 13th October 1915.
HMS Attentive II

14th October 1915 to 8th November 1915
HMS Dolphin (????) - I can't make out the word that has been scrunched in over it, possibly in brackets.

9th November 1915 to 14th January 1916.
HMS Maidstone

15th January 1916 to 26th February 1916.
HMS Dolphin.

27th February 1916 to 29th May 1916.
HMS Titania. (Submarine G5).
10 days in cells (reason not stated) then
9th June 1916 to 11th July 1916.
HMS Titania.

12th July 1916 to 10th August 1916.
HMS Victory II.

11th August 1916 to 10th October 1916.
HMS Inconstant
Followed by 7 days in the cells (reason not stated) then
18th October 1916 to 24th May 1917.
HMS Inconstant
Followed by 90 days Hard Labour – reason Breakout.
On release reports to:-

9th August 1917 to 5th September 1917.
HMS Victory II

6th September 1917 to 13th December 1917.
HMS Vivid II

14th December 1917 to 21st March 1919.
HMS Achilles.

Cheers,
Peter

[RNCVR]

Thanks PRC - I looked over Hall's ADM & read nothing of real importance there, just long service (kind of amazing he actually was not fired out for discipline reasons) so I did not go into detail, just concentrated on his 1WW service for the OP.

 

HMS Dolphin (????) - I can't make out the word that has been scrunched in over it, possibly in brackets.  --  NUBIAN, belongs with Attentive II, not Dolphin.  I mentioned it in my 1st post above...

Edited 19 June , 2022 by RNCVR