Spree Farm Posted 18 May , 2022 Share Posted 18 May , 2022 Hi I am looking for information on the exact where about of the 91st RIR and 2nd Infantry Reserve Division, December 1917. In particular this event. Am Vormittag des 13. Dezember erscheinen im Vorfelde (12. Kompanie) einige unbewaffnete Engländer mit der Roten-Kreuz-Flagge und liefern die Erkennungsmarke eines gefallenen Deutschen ab, nachdem sie kurz vorher bei einer Feldwache des R.I.R. 91 aus demselben Grunde "vorsprachen". Das Regiment verbietet, sich in Zukunft auf derartige Anbiederungen einzulassen. “On the morning of December 13th, some unarmed Englishmen with the Red Cross flag appear in front of 12th Company and delivers the identification tag of a fallen German they held briefly at a field prison belonging to the R.I.R. 91 who they had interviewed. The regiment now forbids getting involved in such interactions in the future”. I believe that it may be part of an entry in Lt/Col Morant private diary for the 10th Bn DLI. If so this may provide information for identifying the exhumation location of three missing DLI men as I have a row of 4 graves, all two identified and two only as DLI . Given the date this narrows it down even further to who the other two may be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 18 May , 2022 Share Posted 18 May , 2022 Hi, you can download their (91 RIR) regimental history here: Adolf Kümmel: "Reserve-Infanterie-Regiment Nr. 91 im Weltkriege 1914 – 1918", Erinnerungsblätter Preußen Bd. 177, Oldenburg-Berlin 1926, Stalling, 473 Seiten. WLB Online-Buch. GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spree Farm Posted 18 May , 2022 Author Share Posted 18 May , 2022 Hi GreyC, Many thanks for this link, any ideas where I could get the diaries for the 2nd Guards IR? I know it must have been before midday on the the 18th as 2Lt Fred Herries, 3rd Bodrer Regt att 10th DLI was reported as dangerously wounds on that day and died the following day 19th. Given that the 10th had only lost 3 men on the 10th an a further 3 on the 16th before Herries's death. This leaves 12 and 13th or the 17th and morning of the 18th. Regards Spree Farm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie2 Posted 18 May , 2022 Share Posted 18 May , 2022 35 minutes ago, Spree Farm said: diaries for the 2nd Guards IR? I presume you mean 2. Garde Reserve Division - there isn‘t a divisional history. Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie2 Posted 18 May , 2022 Share Posted 18 May , 2022 3 hours ago, Spree Farm said: Am Vormittag des 13. Dezember erscheinen im Vorfelde (12. Kompanie) einige unbewaffnete Engländer mit der Roten-Kreuz-Flagge und liefern die Erkennungsmarke eines gefallenen Deutschen ab, nachdem sie kurz vorher bei einer Feldwache des R.I.R. 91 aus demselben Grunde "vorsprachen". Das Regiment verbietet, sich in Zukunft auf derartige Anbiederungen einzulassen. A more accurate translation On the morning of 13 December, some unarmed Englishmen appear in front of the outpost line (12th Company) under the Red Cross flag and deliver the dog tag of a fallen German, having shortly before „spoken“ with a sentry of R.I.R. 91 for the same reason. The regiment forbids engaging in such ingratiation in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spree Farm Posted 18 May , 2022 Author Share Posted 18 May , 2022 Hi My apologies, Yes, 2nd Guard Reserve Division, whatever that consisted of, which units, and where they were between the period of 9th - 13th Dec and 16th - 20th December 1917. "Who was in the trenches opposite to 20SE.V29.b.6.5. to 20SE.V30.a2.8. and on what dates" I know there was a change on the 17th 18th further along the line from 20SE.V30.a2.8. The front shown on the map 20SE map is not quite correct as the main line of defence was between these points due to the ground being more of a quagmire than the rest of the area, if this is possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spree Farm Posted 18 May , 2022 Author Share Posted 18 May , 2022 Sorry once again. My German is not as good as it should be I only learnt survival German when I was stationed in German. Nice place Clausthal im schönen Oberharz been there often during my time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie2 Posted 18 May , 2022 Share Posted 18 May , 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Spree Farm said: Sorry once again No need to be sorry what is the source of the German quote? I have had a quick look at the history of RIR 91 and have found no mention of the occurrence. As I understand it the dog tags were not handed over to RIR 91 but to No.12 Coy of another Regiment. The location of RIR 91 can be seen on map X at the back of the history http://dfg-viewer.de/show?tx_dlf[double]=0&tx_dlf[id]=https%3A%2F%2Fdigital.wlb-stuttgart.de%2Fmets%2Furn%3Anbn%3Ade%3Absz%3A24-digibib-bsz4997994020.xml&tx_dlf[page]=580&cHash=1b33965a0361f2c18427e5a76e74ec15 RIR 91 was flanked by RIR 15 on their right and RIR 77 on the left. The histories of RIR 15 and RIR 77 are not available online. Charlie Edited 18 May , 2022 by charlie2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AOK4 Posted 18 May , 2022 Share Posted 18 May , 2022 Again someone starting a new thread, when one could continue the old thread and avoid doing the same research over and over again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie2 Posted 18 May , 2022 Share Posted 18 May , 2022 59 minutes ago, AOK4 said: doing the same research over and over again... Thank you Jan. Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spree Farm Posted 19 May , 2022 Author Share Posted 19 May , 2022 Not really, Jan had only mentioned the quote but not where I could find the diaries - if they existed. Yes, I replied to Jan as I wasn't sure if I was in the right area to ask this question. I know how uppity some people can become when question are posed in the wrong are or duplicated. This appears to be the case in this instance Also the translations were ambiguous and did not point to the correct regiment, which has gone some way to clarify the question. Do you know where I can source copies of these diaries? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie2 Posted 19 May , 2022 Share Posted 19 May , 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Spree Farm said: Do you know where I can source copies of these diaries David They are not diaries but printed regimental histories in book form, the war diaries went up in smoke in 1945. They are very unlikely to contain grid references. If you are intent on obtaining the regimental histories try obtaining them through your local library. They can be found for sale but are expensive. GreyC has provided you a link to the RIR 91 history. Alfred Wohlenberg: "Das Reserve-Infanterie-Regiment Nr. 77 im Weltkrieg 1914-18", Hildesheim 1931, Gerstenberg Major a. D. Kurt Frh. v. Forstner, Reserve-Infanterie-Regiment Nr. 15 1. Band: Erinnerungsblätter deutscher Regimenter, Preußen, Bd. 271; Oldenburg 1929, Stalling 2. Band: Aus Deutschlands großer Zeit, Bd. 29; Zeulenroda 1930, Sporn Charlie Edited 19 May , 2022 by charlie2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie2 Posted 19 May , 2022 Share Posted 19 May , 2022 The histories of the Infantry Regiments of the 38. Division. IR 94 isn‘t available online Hartmann, Alexander von: "Das Infanterie-Regiment Großherzog von Sachsen (5. Thüringisches) Nr. 94 im Weltkrieg." Kurzgefaßter Überblick. Berlin, Klasing & Co. 1921, 292 Seiten. IR 95 https://digital.wlb-stuttgart.de/index.php?id=6&tx_dlf[id]=10339&tx_dlf[page]=1 IR 96 https://digital.wlb-stuttgart.de/sammlungen/sammlungsliste/werksansicht?tx_dlf[double]=0&tx_dlf[id]=1963&tx_dlf[order]=title&tx_dlf[page]=1&cHash=d9ff62df789d1ba35553c882066f44cc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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