Essex Regiment - Diet Sheet for W/E 29th December 1917

[Gunner Bailey]

I've got a diet sheet for the Essex Regiment which is interesting in itself. But the structure of Regiments is not my area of expertise so I have a few questions. Anyone who specialises in the Essex Regiment may be able to answer them quickly.

1) Where were the regiment in December 1917?

2) The sheet is labelled (A) Battalion - why not a number?

3) The sheet is signed off by Major H T Argent. Herbert Argent worked his way up the ranks, A South African veteran with the City of London Volunteers he mainly seems to have been associated with the 5th Essex. Other officers named on the sheet are Lt C E Hodson and E J Strutt (Adjutant).

4) There are five 'meals' on the diet sheet. Gunfire, Breakfast, Dinner, Tea, Supper. Gunfire?

5) Under Argent's name is stated P.R.I (A) Batt. Essex Regiment. What is this designation? 

 

Any clarification would be appreciated. Thanks

[FROGSMILE]

On 15/04/2022 at 08:27, Gunner Bailey said:

I've got a diet sheet for the Essex Regiment which is interesting in itself. But the structure of Regiments is not my area of expertise so I have a few questions. Anyone who specialises in the Essex Regiment may be able to answer them quickly.

1) Where were the regiment in December 1917?

2) The sheet is labelled (A) Battalion - why not a number?

3) The sheet is signed off by Major H T Argent. Herbert Argent worked his way up the ranks, A South African veteran with the City of London Volunteers he mainly seems to have been associated with the 5th Essex. Other officers named on the sheet are Lt C E Hodson and E J Strutt (Adjutant).

4) There are five 'meals' on the diet sheet. Gunfire, Breakfast, Dinner, Tea, Supper. Gunfire?

5) Under Argent's name is stated P.R.I (A) Batt. Essex Regiment. What is this designation? 

 

Any clarification would be appreciated. Thanks

1.  The ‘Essex Regiment’ consisted of a set number of battalions, basically comprising two regulars 1st and 2nd and the rest either Reserve, Auxiliary, or War Service (hostilities) only.  Ergo to ascertain location in Dec 1917 you will need to establish first which battalion you’re interested in.

2.  It needs further research of the actual document to answer that question (can you post an image), but it implies that a battalion was being raised that had not yet been designated with a number.  In such cases where perhaps a number of units were being raised, often initially in tented encampments, it was common to differentiate them by temporary title such as ‘A Battalion’, ‘B Battalion’, etc.  

3. 5th Essex were a prewar Territorial Force battalion headquartered in Chelmsford.  Many retired TF officers were utilised in the early months of the war to assist with the raising, administration and early training of the War Service battalions formed with Kitchener recruits. That might well be what Major Argent was engaged in.

4. ‘Gunfire’ refers to tea served at dawn as a first beverage to rouse troops to the day’s activities.  It was often served (but not always) mixed with a rum ration in winter. The association with gunfire relates to the historical pre dawn routine whereby encampments had been roused by firing the guns in order to get everyone moving simultaneously at a time before widespread access to clocks, but also to remove any charges slightly dampened from early morning dew and then reloading of the guns with dry powder for the ‘stand-to-arms’ that traditionally followed gunfire (stand-to was deemed the early period with imperfect light when an enemy was most likely to attack the encampment). Company cooks were roused even earlier by sentinels from the guard tent in order to boil up the coppers of hot water necessary for the tea.

5.  ‘PRI’ refers to President of the Regimental Institute, which was (is still) the financial account maintained by cavalry regiments, infantry battalions, artillery batteries, and service support units, to administer the internal economy of unit canteens and shops.  All profits made were recycled back into the account.  Funds made were used to finance, or offset (‘defray’) the cost of soldiers entertainment (such as concerts and smokers), and purchase further stocks of tobacco and beverages, including alcohol.  It was run via ‘double entry’ book keeping and often overseen by the joint efforts of the unit’s adjutant and quartermaster.

Edited 17 April , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]

Afternote: Given his involvement in both, diet sheets, and the PRI, it suggests to me that Maj Argent was probably the quartermaster, a role invariably fulfilled by an officer raised from the ranks.

Edited 15 April , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[Gunner Bailey]

Many thanks for the answers so far. I agree that it is possibly a new battalion in training. Argent was wounded in 1916 and surrendered his commission in 1919 due to the effect of his wounds on his health. In the Boer War he was a lance corporal so again what you say fits.

Here's a couple of photo's of the relevant bits.

[FROGSMILE]

2 hours ago, Gunner Bailey said:

Many thanks for the answers so far. I agree that it is possibly a new battalion in training. Argent was wounded in 1916 and surrendered his commission in 1919 due to the effect of his wounds on his health. In the Boer War he was a lance corporal so again what you say fits.

Here's a couple of photo's of the relevant bits.

Yes I think it does fit the scenario as the images certainly seem to confirm matters, they are typical aspects within the bailiwick of a unit quartermaster.  The only thing that puzzled me a little is the typing of the A designation within parentheses.  It might perhaps relate to an Administrative Battalion, further documentation might tease out what it is for sure. Often there might be permanent infrastructure within a brigade sized encampment run by elderly officers and SNCOs and titled, A Battalion, B Battalion, etc. and new units arriving to undergo training then roulemented through on rotation.  That may well be what is occurring in this instance.

NB.  Incidentally gunfire still exists within British Army ‘dietary’ traditions today, but generally only on regimental honour days and Christmas Day for those still on duty.  No firing of guns though!  In these latter circumstances it is traditionally served to soldiers in bed by the officers and SNCOs of their unit.

Edited 15 April , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[A Lancashire Fusilier by Proxy]

In January 1918 my grandfather writes:

I was doing a few jobs at this time, Adjutant, Mess President and P.R.I.

He was only temporarily the Adjutant, his more normal job at this time being OC Company, but the Battalion HQ staff had been subject to a gas attack at the beginning of January, and were all out of action.

This is the only mention he makes of being P.R.I., and he does not expand on what it involved. However, earlier in the diary, in October 1915, having just described improving billets and setting up a bathhouse, he goes on:

In addition to these conveniences, I erected a small wooden shed at Crucifix Corner – just at the entrance to the communication trench leading up La Boiselle Road. In this hut we sold hot coffee, soup, chocolate, cigarettes, notepaper, matches, boot laces, buttons, and other odd useful accessories. This proved a great asset to the men, and incidentally quite a profitable concern. All our own men derived direct benefit from the profits as they were divided amongst the Companies, each month for extra messing.

I have wondered whether this would have been done as P.R.I., He doesn’t say so, but the way in which it worked seems to be in line with the system described by Frogsmile.

On the subject of “Gunfire”, on the morning of 9 September 1916, the day the 55^th Division attacked Ginchy, he writes:

It was a raw cold foggy morning – fairly quiet – the usual Machine Gun fire sweeping the ground (just to boil the water in the M G water coolers for morning Gun Fire tea).

Is the comment about the water in the machine gun coolers being used for making tea tongue in cheek?

[FROGSMILE]

On 15/04/2022 at 19:14, A Lancashire Fusilier by Proxy said:

In January 1918 my grandfather writes:

I was doing a few jobs at this time, Adjutant, Mess President and P.R.I.

He was only temporarily the Adjutant, his more normal job at this time being OC Company, but the Battalion HQ staff had been subject to a gas attack at the beginning of January, and were all out of action.

This is the only mention he makes of being P.R.I., and he does not expand on what it involved. However, earlier in the diary, in October 1915, having just described improving billets and setting up a bathhouse, he goes on:

In addition to these conveniences, I erected a small wooden shed at Crucifix Corner – just at the entrance to the communication trench leading up La Boiselle Road. In this hut we sold hot coffee, soup, chocolate, cigarettes, notepaper, matches, boot laces, buttons, and other odd useful accessories. This proved a great asset to the men, and incidentally quite a profitable concern. All our own men derived direct benefit from the profits as they were divided amongst the Companies, each month for extra messing.

I have wondered whether this would have been done as P.R.I., He doesn’t say so, but the way in which it worked seems to be in line with the system described by Frogsmile.

On the subject of “Gunfire”, on the morning of 9 September 1916, the day the 55^th Division attacked Ginchy, he writes:

It was a raw cold foggy morning – fairly quiet – the usual Machine Gun fire sweeping the ground (just to boil the water in the M G water coolers for morning Gun Fire tea).

Is the comment about the water in the machine gun coolers being used for making tea tongue in cheek?

The battalion’s shop would definitely have been under the PRI.  It was standard practice across the army and PRI regulations were consulted when the Army and Navy Canteen Board was set up during the war (later becoming NAAFI - but complementing, not in place of individual unit PRIs).

The use of boiling water from MGs to make tea is oft mentioned in various histories of the war, so coinciding the practice with making ‘gun fire’ on a particular occasion when guns have undertaken sustained firing (i.e. a MG barrage) is entirely logical and likely.  It would have needed rum to take away the inevitable gun oil taint.

NB.  ‘Extra Messing’ is a process by which extra, fresh produce (fruit, eggs, etc.) and various condiments and expensive beverages (salt, pepper, savouries and coffee), unsupported by military rationing, are provided.  Each mess manages its own extra messing according to its needs (so officers’, sergeants’, and each rifle company).  It, extra messing, still exists even though the feeding system has changed substantially.

Edited 28 October , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[Gunner Bailey]

Very interesting information. Having been on the forum since 2005 I'm amazed I've not seen this before. Many thanks.

[FROGSMILE]

2 hours ago, Gunner Bailey said:

Very interesting information. Having been on the forum since 2005 I'm amazed I've not seen this before. Many thanks.

I think that PRI and Gunfire morning tea have been mentioned before, but not perhaps within the overall context of your five questions. 

[A Lancashire Fusilier by Proxy]

Thank you, Frogsmile, as ever, for being a fount of useful information. And if my ramblings have prompted the emergence of additional information of interest to Gunner Bailey, that is good too.

[Gunner Bailey]

8 hours ago, A Lancashire Fusilier by Proxy said:

Thank you, Frogsmile, as ever, for being a fount of useful information. And if my ramblings have prompted the emergence of additional information of interest to Gunner Bailey, that is good too.

Feel free to ramble on! 

[Skipman]

"Gun-fire tea" is mentioned in the 2nd Black Watch diary 9/4/1917

Mike

[mike st]

I don't know where I read it but my understanding was that 'Gun fire' was made by boiling a Dixie, tipping in a handful of tea leaves and a can of condensed milk.

The resultant mixture of stewed tea with a lot of sugar, taken with a woodbine was considered to be ideal to awake a soldier from sound sleep.

Edited 30 October , 2022 by mike st

[A Lancashire Fusilier by Proxy]

In Robert Graves' Goodbye to All That Chapter 13, he quotes the following from one of his letters home, written in May 1915 from the Cambrin area (after a comment that there was a lot of wastage at the front and that kindling was scarce):

Our machine-gun crew boil their hot water by firing off belt after belt of ammunition at no particular target, just generally spraying the German line. After several pounds' worth of ammunition has been used, the water in the guns - which are water-cooled - begins to boil ... 

[WhiteStarLine]

I thought the general consensus was that the this was a soldiers' tale and the cooling jacket water would be so contaminated with oils and other impurities it would be undrinkable.  Graves is a great storyteller but perhaps not to be taken literally.

[mike st]

I do not see how oil would get into the water cooling jacket.

[WhiteStarLine]

Hi Mike, in a pristine system I agree.  Under field conditions that existed in trench warfare, I suspect the water poured in had traces of petrol, gun oil and mud.

I wonder if there are any tales from Vickers crew saying this occurred?  That would constitute a credible source.

Cheers, Bill

[mike st]

Bill, the problem with this sort of thing is that there is no one left alive to ask.

People will do all sorts of daft things and no doubt someone tried using the hot water in the cooling jacket for tea.

 

[FROGSMILE]

I’m not 100% certain as it’s been some years since I last read it (again), but I think the WW1 classic book: “With a Machine Gun to Camrai” was where I first read it.

“Each water-jacket contained 7.5 pints of water when full. The rate of boiling depended upon the rate of fire.” 

There is much recorded about potential problems with steam giving away the position of guns during sustained firing prewar and also the need to add specified amounts of glycerin to prevent freezing of the jacket in extreme cold weather.  However, during the war itself there are enough tales of urination in lieu during water shortage and the use of hot water for crew tea in isolated conditions for me to think that they are not all apocryphal.

For details of water cooling see: https://vickersmg.blog/in-use/accessories/water-cooling-and-condensing-equipment/

[A Lancashire Fusilier by Proxy]

10 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

but I think the WW1 classic book: “With a Machine Gun to Camrai” was where I first read it.

I had a similar thought, so had a look in my copy of George Coppard’s book.

I think his fullest description of how the Vickers worked is towards the end of Chapter 10, but even when he mentions that a powerful emission of steam was condensed through a pliable tube into a canvas bucket there is no mention of sometimes using that to make tea.

In the next chapter he mentions that while they were in the Hohenzollern Redoubt there was no possibility of making tea as they couldn’t risk lighting a fire, so after a long night they had to make do with tepid water to drink with their breakfast. Again no mention of one possible solution being to use the water from the gun to make tea (though how did they make the water even tepid, I wonder?)

But the most relevant passage for the purposes of this thread, which I confess I had completely forgotten about, comes towards the end of Chapter 21:

I must mention here that Captain Graves in Goodbye to All That refers to machine gun crews indiscriminately firing off belt after belt to boil their water. This suggests that machine gunners who fancied a cup of tea or a shave simply fired off a couple of belts. In fact, this was not the case, as tea laced with mineral oil would be pretty ghastly. Also machine gun crews who fired “indiscriminately” might well be engaged on barrage fire, and infantry officers would not necessarily be aware of that fact.

So no support for Robert Graves’ veracity from George Coppard after all, and it certainly doesn’t sound as though he or his crew were ever even tempted to use water heated by their gun for tea. But I wonder whether that means it was never done, particularly with - as Frogsmile says - there being so many stories about it. And would drinking tea with a bit of mineral oil in it (presumably laced with sweet condensed milk) be so very much worse than drinking cold water that had been carried in a petrol can?

[FROGSMILE]

14 minutes ago, A Lancashire Fusilier by Proxy said:

I had a similar thought, so had a look in my copy of George Coppard’s book.

I think his fullest description of how the Vickers worked is towards the end of Chapter 10, but even when he mentions that a powerful emission of steam was condensed through a pliable tube into a canvas bucket there is no mention of sometimes using that to make tea.

In the next chapter he mentions that while they were in the Hohenzollern Redoubt there was no possibility of making tea as they couldn’t risk lighting a fire, so after a long night they had to make do with tepid water to drink with their breakfast. Again no mention of one possible solution being to use the water from the gun to make tea (though how did they make the water even tepid, I wonder?)

But the most relevant passage for the purposes of this thread, which I confess I had completely forgotten about, comes towards the end of Chapter 21:

I must mention here that Captain Graves in Goodbye to All That refers to machine gun crews indiscriminately firing off belt after belt to boil their water. This suggests that machine gunners who fancied a cup of tea or a shave simply fired off a couple of belts. In fact, this was not the case, as tea laced with mineral oil would be pretty ghastly. Also machine gun crews who fired “indiscriminately” might well be engaged on barrage fire, and infantry officers would not necessarily be aware of that fact.

So no support for Robert Graves’ veracity from George Coppard after all, and it certainly doesn’t sound as though he or his crew were ever even tempted to use water heated by their gun for tea. But I wonder whether that means it was never done, particularly with - as Frogsmile says - there being so many stories about it. And would drinking tea with a bit of mineral oil in it (presumably laced with sweet condensed milk) be so very much worse than drinking cold water that had been carried in a petrol can?

Thank you for that useful reminder of what George Coppard had actually said (I no longer have his book).  I think there are several good and relevant points made.  The hot water produced was unlikely to be purposefully for tea and more likely a byproduct of sustained tactical firing.  The water would often have been tainted either deliberately (glycerine) or accidentally (polluted by mineral oil), but minimal amounts would not be unfamiliar given that water resupply was routinely provided in old petrol cans (for want of other containers).  It’s also true that there are numerous anecdotes of tainted tea being masked as much as possible by liberal dosing with sugar and condensed milk.  I suspect that the truth of the matter is somewhere in between.  It probably wasn’t a widespread practice across the front, but there might well have been individual incidents where it did occur and stuck in mens minds through the incongruous nature of resorting to doing it.

Edited 4 November , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[mike st]

Not being familiar with the Vickers, exactly how did you fill it up seeing that the cap was underneath the barrel. Did they tip it upside down?

[FROGSMILE]

32 minutes ago, mike st said:

Not being familiar with the Vickers, exactly how did you fill it up seeing that the cap was underneath the barrel. Did they tip it upside down?

“Fill the water jacket.  To do this, bring the gun to a horizontal position and remove the filling-hole plug.  Take water as free from sediment as possible (as grit will cause copper plating of the barrel and allow it to rust), and, using the filling cup, insert the nozzle into the filling cavity.  Fill until the water pours out of the water jacket steam escape hole, when the jacket will be sufficiently filled.  Replace the filling-hole plug.”

The filling hole is on the top at the front.

Edited 4 November , 2022 by FROGSMILE

[J T Gray]

Having once been handed a bottle that, on swigging, turned out not to contain the advertised beverage but paraffin, I suspect anyone drinking tea laced with mineral oil would be spending a lot of time in the latrine. The effects of mineral oil on the intestines is fairly volcanic.

The handee turned up the next day, playing cricket against my village, so when I came out to bat I described the effect to him, as he was fielding at short leg, roughly where my rump was pointing. He wasn't a happy bunny.

[Andrew Upton]

5 hours ago, A Lancashire Fusilier by Proxy said:

...So no support for Robert Graves’ veracity from George Coppard after all, and it certainly doesn’t sound as though he or his crew were ever even tempted to use water heated by their gun for tea. But I wonder whether that means it was never done, particularly with - as Frogsmile says - there being so many stories about it. And would drinking tea with a bit of mineral oil in it (presumably laced with sweet condensed milk) be so very much worse than drinking cold water that had been carried in a petrol can?

https://vickersmg.blog/in-use/myths/

"However, in Goldsmith (1994), the author cites an interview with a veteran, Corporal John Young, 12th MG Company, who says:

…During the Battle of the Somme in July 1916, and later at Ypres, Belgium in 1918, we used the watercooled Vickers machine gun. When we would run short of water for tea we would frequently empty the barrel jacket of the gun. The tea was a wee bit greasy but tasted alright.

 

1 hour ago, FROGSMILE said:

“Fill the water jacket.  To do this, bring the gun to a horizontal position and remove the filling-hole plug.  Take water as free from sediment as possible (as grit will cause copper plating of the barrel and allow it to rust), and, using the filling cup, insert the nozzle into the filling cavity.  Fill until the water pours out of the water jacket steam escape hole, when the jacket will be sufficiently filled.  Replace the filling-hole plug.”

...The filling hole is on the top at the front...

 

The filling hole for the Vickers/Maxim is at the top rear of the water jacket, not the front, eg: