busterfield Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 To keep things simple regarding a family history problem I have a few questions. On birth certificates issued to children born December 1905, and the first quarter of 1911 what information would be included on a birth certificate ? I have a couple of exact dates of birth of children from from post WW1service records, yet cannot find them on, https://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl Can I apply for birth certificates usin name and date of birth ? They don't seem to be record friendly as I cannot find them on 1911 census forms, yet on the 1921 the father is dead. As he was alive in 1913 and dead in 1921 I'm wondering if he was a WW1 casualty. Asking for more information would get tricky as the mother known then as May Hawkins born 1890 in Dublin was also Bridget Mary. Her husband named on a wedding certificate as Percy could from family lore be John who served in the navy. See what I mean about tricky.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 31 minutes ago, busterfield said: To keep things simple regarding a family history problem I have a few questions. On birth certificates issued to children born December 1905, and the first quarter of 1911 what information would be included on a birth certificate ? I have a couple of exact dates of birth of children from from post WW1service records, yet cannot find them on, https://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl Can I apply for birth certificates usin name and date of birth ? They don't seem to be record friendly as I cannot find them on 1911 census forms, yet on the 1921 the father is dead. As he was alive in 1913 and dead in 1921 I'm wondering if he was a WW1 casualty. Asking for more information would get tricky as the mother known then as May Hawkins born 1890 in Dublin was also Bridget Mary. Her husband named on a wedding certificate as Percy could from family lore be John who served in the navy. See what I mean about tricky.. What information do you have on the man and we'll see what we can pull up - we've cracked similar ones before ! Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busterfield Posted 16 January , 2022 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2022 From Ancestry. This is the only reference to the paternal name. It is in Edward John Hawkins born 23/12/1905. From his service record which gives NOK as Mary 85 princes road, the same as the 1921 census which gives his brothers as Percy 10 years 4 months, and Joseph 7 years and 10 months at the time of the census. Bridget M(ary) born 1888-1890 appears appears in a number of electoral rolls in theythirties and fifties along with Percy Clement Hawkins and P.J.C Hawkins. The youngest brother Joseph Edward Hawkins, https://www.cwgc.org/find-records/find-war-dead/casualty-details/2128586/joseph-edward-hawkins/ Gives parents M. B. Hawkins as the mother used any version of Bridget, May, and Mary this could just be the mother's name. aside from that very little. I was hoping for information on what is included on birth certificates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 Here's an extract of 1905 birth to show what sort of information was given (it's not really much different today). https://i.pinimg.com/originals/3a/c5/56/3ac556012d879831392f8c14c1684bee.jpg Remember, though, the information was only as good as the person giving it wanted it to be. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busterfield Posted 16 January , 2022 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2022 Thank you for that picture. I wasn't sure if father and mother were mentioned on pre 1911 certificates. I think I may be shelling out a few £11s to GRO soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 1 hour ago, busterfield said: the father is dead. As he was alive in 1913 and dead in 1921 I'm wondering if he was a WW1 casualty What details do you know of him ? Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busterfield Posted 16 January , 2022 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2022 As good as nothing. The only real reference to him is in the wedding of his son shown in an earlier posting. That along with family lore that says he may have been in the navy, and he may have been named John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEW Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 If you register with GRO and search from their site although the search is a bit more basic you will get the mother's maiden name in search results for pre-1915 births which might help and costs nothing. TEW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 2 hours ago, busterfield said: On birth certificates issued to children born December 1905, and the first quarter of 1911 wha 2 hours ago, busterfield said: as the mother known then as May Hawkins born 1890 in Dublin was also Bridget Mary. It may be more difficult with the fact that she would only have been 15 when the first child was born. 2 hours ago, busterfield said: As he was alive in 1913 and dead in 1921 I'm wondering if he was a WW1 casualty What is the 1913 record ? Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busterfield Posted 16 January , 2022 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2022 (edited) Thanks Tew I'll give that a go first. Edited 16 January , 2022 by busterfield wrong box Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busterfield Posted 16 January , 2022 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2022 Craig the 1939 register has her DOB as 22/1/1889, still young. The 1913 reference is the DOB of the third son Joseph Edward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf mcm Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 On the assumption that Percy died in England, Freebmd has only 3 suitable candidates between 1913 and 1921. Are any of these deaths in areas where the family lived? Perhaps local newspapers can give family details. Surname First name(s) Age District Vol Page Deaths Dec 1913 (>99%) Hawkins Percy S 22 Southwark 1d 45 Deaths Jun 1915 (>99%) Hawkins Percy J 24 Bridge 2a 1265 Deaths Mar 1920 (>99%) HAWKINS Percy H 34 Brighton 2b 315 Regards, Alf McM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busterfield Posted 16 January , 2022 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2022 Using Tew's advice I registered at GRO and got results. It seems as though Mother's maiden name was Towers. So I'll save myself £4 per son by downloading a PDF @£7 a go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf mcm Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 This is th marriage on Freebmd. Regards, Alf McM Surname First name(s) District Vol Page Marriages Mar 1905 (>99%) HAWKINS Percy Clement Fulham 1a 389 TOWERS Bridget Mary Fulham 1a 389 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf mcm Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 (edited) This tree appears to show that Percy didn't die until 1955! Perhaps he and Bridget went their own ways? https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/17983578/person/360025892110/facts The tree shows that he was in the Navy. Regards, Alf McM Edited 16 January , 2022 by alf mcm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IPT Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 From Ancestry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 Percy in 1911 FMP 1911 census Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 Whoever completed the form knew enough to know he was married 6 years but he declared no children to the mariage. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 MFB - Metropolitan Fire Brigade? Form was filled in by the landlady, Mrs. Cooper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 Just now, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said: MFB - Metropolitan Fire Brigade? Form was filled in by the landlady, Mrs. Cooper. I thought that as well about MFB. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf mcm Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 This clip from the West London Observer of 10th August 1906 may explain why they split up. Image courtesey of Findmypast. Regards, Alf McM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busterfield Posted 16 January , 2022 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2022 Thanks for the many replies. I had spotted the 1911 census, but the no children threw me off track. As my grandfather walked out of his marriage around 1920(ish) I know it happened. I see that the the Navy service didn't last very long. I'll have a good dig around in the ancestry tree and check what I can before accepting everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 16 January , 2022 Share Posted 16 January , 2022 The navy man states his DoB as April 1884 Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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