NCOs lose stripes

[EMUnsworth]

Reading my Great Uncle's diary (Manchester Regiment) and note on Aug 1, 1915 he states, "All draft NCOs lose their stripes from today". Does anyone know why this would be?

[ss002d6252]

36 minutes ago, EMUnsworth said:

Reading my Great Uncle's diary (Manchester Regiment) and note on Aug 1, 1915 he states, "All draft NCOs lose their stripes from today". Does anyone know why this would be?

Probably acting ranks in the previous battalion. The current battalion they arrived at likely had a full complement of substantive ranks, so the temporary ranks dropped back down.

Craig

[Moonraker]

Welcome to the Forum

I always hesitate to guess, especially when more knowledgeable members will be posting shortly (as Craig just has!), but ANZAC soldiers who had been promoted to NCOs during training lost a stripe when about to depart for active service on the grounds that they knew less about actual warfare than might soldiers junior to them. I haven't heard of this happening in the case of British regiments, but it does seem plausible.

[EMUnsworth]

Thanks to you both

[Guest]

Mate,

My understanding is the same.

Most Draft units had Temp Ranks to command the sub unit they were in until they arrived at there units

In the AIF they were called Provisional ranks (often shown as (Prov) in records, also others show (Temp) Temporary

once in units there (Prov or Temp) ranks are not needed.

S.B

[Bryn]

It appears to have been a common practice, in the AIF at least, that soldiers were appointed to temporary ranks for the voyage from Australia, then reverted to their substantive ranks on joining the battalion once the 'getting there' part of the trip was over.

[EMUnsworth]

Thanks all for this info.

[charlie962]

On 14/11/2021 at 15:10, Moonraker said:

ANZAC soldiers who had been promoted to NCOs during training lost a stripe when about to depart for active service on the grounds that they knew less about actual warfare than might soldiers junior to them. I haven't heard of this happening in the case of British regiments, but it does seem plausible.

I've seen at least one report  in War Diary of British CO complaining that replacements with no previous field service arrive with higher ranks than men already with the Bn and that it stops promotion of the latter, to detriment of the Bn.

Charlie

[EMUnsworth]

That's understandable!

[Guest]

Mate,

Prob why the AIF used Prov or Temp ranks, as they could be returned to the ranks without a FGCM

Strange that we would use these and not the British Army as we took them as our base for all Military?

S.B

[Fromelles]

Within the AIF, at least, it was referred to as an Acting rank (not Provisional or Temporary rank, which were used for something different). I imagine the British used something similar -

Acting Rank - Initially a paid appointment, NCO's of Reinforcements were deemed to be acting appointments which could be withdrawn at any time if the services of the NCO's concerned were unsatisfactory. The withdrawal of appointment were not be made prior to embarkation without the approval of the OC of the camp in which the men are located nor during the voyage except with the approval of the OC Troops.

Acting NCO's would continue to hold such rank while employed with reinforcements until they were absorbed on the establishment of their respective Unit.

Acting ranks were initially paid an 'Extra Duty' payment, but this was later replaced by Extra Duty Pay/Voyage Only (EDP/VO) appointments. Acting ranks later (unsure when) ceased to carry additional pay.

Dan

Edited 24 December , 2021 by Fromelles