US Soldier MIA non- commemorations

[Hugh Shipman]

Does anyone have any expertise in the area of American MIAs? 

 

I am researching casualties of the US 105th Engineers. Specifically I am looking for casualties from a gas beam release on 27th August 1918 at Ypres. Gas blew back onto the engineers near Transport Farm. Of the five possible casualties from this unit on this day, one is named in the unit war diary as killed outright, Dave Lee of North Carolina, and he is buried at the American Cemetery in Waregem, Belgium. 

 

Two other engineers are recorded as severely effected by gas, and I suspect these to be Privates Stroman and Barlow, also buried in Waregem.

 

The unit record in North Carolina recognises Dave Lee as dying on this day, but also names two others of the 105th killed (Misssing) on tis day:-

 

Arnette, James H.

Grisdale Jesse D.

 

Both of these feature in the Roll of Honor printed in various newspapers.  Arnette is 'wounded' (New York Tribune 3.10.18) Mssing in Action (Hickory Daily Record 3.10.18) and Killed in Action (The Commenwealth 29.4.19) 

Grisdale is Missing in Action (Hickory Daily Record 7.10.18) Killed in Action (previously Missing in Action) (The Evening Star, Washington 18.5.19).

 

Leaving aside how these soldiers could go missing while releasing gas from a train, I was wondering if anyone had any insight into American MIAs from WW1. Are these just part of a wider group unlucky not to be commemorated, or is this a genuine oversight?

 

 

 

 

Edited 12 April , 2021 by Hugh Shipman

[Hugh Shipman]

Later sources have Arnette as Arnett.

Also not recorded for commemoration, WELLS Jacob L. died in hospital, gassed on either 29th August or 5th September 1918.

[4thGordons]

I think I am missing something here.

Why do you think they are "missing"

 

A large proportion of US casualties' mortal remains were returned home to their families (a process that continued in to the early 1920s) and were buried in private plots in their home towns etc so it would not be unusual for two casualties to have no AMBC record.

 

The official number of US MIAs for WWI is very small (the official figures were as of Aug 1 1919 that there were only 46 MIAs - p122 The War with Germany A Statistical Summary) and while obviously such figures should be taken with a grain of salt I suspect that the most obvious reason for the lack of an official grave is that the mortal remains were repatriated.

 

Apologies if I have misunderstood,

Chris

 

 

Edit -- I did a quick google search to see if I could discover what percentage were repatriated and while I did not yet find this I do note the Wiki lists American MIA from WWI as 3350 although the source is not quoted.

Edited 12 April , 2021 by 4thGordons
add information

[Hugh Shipman]

Hi Chris,

 

Pte Wells who died in hospital might well have been repatriated. But I'm asking whether he would or should be memorialis(z)ed somewhere, at least on the US database of those who died.

 

As for the two missing, and in 1919 declared KIA, the following is a report into the incident which leaves the strong possibility that these men are still missing and are not commemorated anywhere:-

 

27th August 1918

[My notes]

 

"I left the detail with Corporal and went back to look for the others, and found nine near the trench. At this time the air was clear, and all gas was absent. All these nine men had been gassed more or less, two being in bad shape [Barlow, Stroman - see above]. I went through the gap, and found Lee on the wire dead. We hunted for the other two [This would be Arnett and Grisdale] that night but could not find them. I have been out on patrols with Lieutenant Murphey and some of the men, and we have scoured the area, but have not been able to locate them"

(Sgt 1st Class Hinson)

 

As they died in the war, shouldn't these three be on the ABMC database? Or on some other official list  of those who gave their lives? 

 

 

ves

Edited 12 April , 2021 by Hugh Shipman

[4thGordons]

ABMC only has a list of graves or memorials in their care --  no records of those buried in the US.

Many battlefield casualties/burials were returned home during the period that the graves were being concentrated in the post war period.

 

 

There is no real equivalent to the CWGC in the US with a more or less comprehensive list.

So they MAY have been memorialized on a local monument and they may (if their family requested it) have a veterans stone or grave marker but there is no necessity that they would have been and as far as I am aware there is no comprehensive list of US casualties.

 

Because of the federal nature of the US system sometimes there are State lists of casualties (esp if a state had heavily engaged National Guard units) and sometimes state memorials but not always.

Many towns and cities had memorials upon which men were listed and quite a few cities/counties published "Honor Rolls" in 1919-22 with casualties listed and small biographies but there is no comprehensive or near comprehensive record.

 

There were several books published post war Soldiers of the Great War (again on a state by state basis) but these are very far from comprehensive.

I have relatively limited experience with tracking Illinois soldiers and there are LOTS in private cemeteries around here I am lucky that the state of IL conducted a survey of veterans graves in 1929 and that lists almost all repatriated WWI casualties.

Some years ago several members of this forum I was able to track down the grave site of a Nurse who died in the UK and was originally buried there but when I looked for her grave I was unable to find it and it eventually turned out her remains had been repatriated in the early 20s.

 

Chris

 

 

 

Edited 12 April , 2021 by 4thGordons

[PRC]

Ok I'll bite and display my ignorance - there is a national US database of the fallen of the Great War?

 

While I was looking for the names I came across the following:-

Jesse Grisdale

Headstone at Oakland Cemetery, Charlotte https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/48120889/jesse-d-grisdale

Page has a link to a blogpost on the "friendly fire" incident that claimed his life.

https://grisdalefamily.wordpress.com/2013/09/03/jesse-d-grisdale-a-north-carolina-victim-of-friendly-fire-at-ypres-1918/

The familysearch website also has him listed in the source United States, World War I American Expeditionary Forces Deaths, 1917-1919

 

They should all potentially turn up in the Soldiers in the Great War series.

Volume 2 covers North Carolina and is available here if you are a member of familysearch or want to sign up https://www.familysearch.org/library/books/records/item/517588-soldiers-of-the-great-war-vol-2?offset=1

 

Hope that helps,

Peter

Edited 12 April , 2021 by PRC
Typo

[Hugh Shipman]

That's really useful! Thanks to both of you. 

 

I found this

Doughboy-MIA - World War I Centennial (worldwar1centennial.org)

A database of all the US WW1 MIAs, but they are not in there either. I'll submit these names and see what they have to say.

 

I wonder if the Grisdale marker has a body under it. It's of course possible that the two were eventually recovered after the

30th Division left the area and packed off back to the US, but notably their comrades were buried in Flanders.

 

Thanks Peter for the great idea of using findagrave.com. Here is Wells, who died in hospital some days after being gassed

Jacob Luther Wells (1888-1918) - Find A Grave Memorial

 

But of James H. Arnett or Arnette soldier no. 1329698 from Charlotte there is nothing.

Edited 12 April , 2021 by Hugh Shipman

[PRC]

I don't know if it adds anything, but additional information from familysearch

 

Jesse David Grisdale. Born 21st July 1890 - source Veterans Administration Master Index, 1917-1940

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QPRB-C7R4

Born McAdeuville, North Carolina. Army Serial Number 1,329,754. Initially served D Company, 1st N.C. Infantry from May 1, 1917 - source North Carolina, World War I Service Cards, 1917-1919

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2H2-F25Z

 

Volume 2 of Soldiers in the Great War associates Private James H. Arnette with Charlotte and has him recorded as Killed in Action. (page 401)

James H. Arnette, born McAdensville, North Carolina - (is that the same place as Jesse Grisdale?), circa 1896. He enlisted on the 23rd July 1917 when his stated age was 21 years and 7 months. Army Serial Number was 1,329, 698. Initially served D Company, 1st N.C. Infantry. Next of kin notified of his death was his father, James A. Arnette, of Elsworth Avenue, Charlotte.

- source North Carolina, World War I Service Cards, 1917-1919

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2H2-X28W

 

The North Carolina World War 1 Service Cards does have one Jacob L. Wells, but he was discharged in June 1919. Army Serial number 1,894,922.

 

Hope that helps,

Peter

[Hugh Shipman]

Jacob L' Wells, that's a co-incidence, It's a different number, see the findagrave link which has additional information.

 

The Doughboy  MIAs have been very prompt with a fulsome reply.  As these two are not identified MIAs but rather KIAs, there will or should be a Burial Case File held at the National Personnel Records Center in St. Louis, Missouri. This is the place to ask but they are currently closed. However they offered to help find Arnette once rhings open up.

 

Actually they gave me a chunk of interesting information which I'll ask if I can post about post-war procedures of the Graves Registration Service. 

[4thGordons]

I am close to the St Louis Center (well 100 miles) and have been there several times the staff are usually very helpful

Unfortunately there was a catastrophic fire there in 1973 which destroyed a huge chunk of the WWI records -- so that may be a dead end also.

 

I have paper copies of the Soldiers of the Great War and just from exploring Illinois records know that the books are incomplete but if I get a moment this evening I will have a look (they are oddly organized)

 

There may also be county level records/honor rolls which record the soldiers - however these are very hit and miss

If you find them they are fantastic resources (for example here is the one for the county I live in)   http://www.idaillinois.org/digital/collection/isl8/id/4046/

I have collected a couple of dozen of these over time but the coverage is patchy.

 

Chris

[Hugh Shipman]

I've learned a lot from my brush with the US Army in its brief time on my patch here south of Ypres. That it is not a monolithic, top down construction and that in remembrance, it is also not structured so. It is to the States and communities that you should look for record keeping. And to groups of research professionals like the Doughboys MIA list keepers, and (I don't know who funds this) The National WW1 Museum and Memorial, Here is their very good page with suggested research aids:-

Military Records by State | National WWI Museum and Memorial (theworldwar.org)

 

I notice that the three US soldiers who died but were not buried in Flanders are not on the In Flanders Fields name list, and it is a shame that that project does not seem to be curated anymore. And having found the burials of Grisdale and Wells, the only thing left for this thread is to find out whether Private Arnette is buried somewhere. The Buriel Case File in St Louis will clear that up.

 

What Robert L, the Director of Doughboys MIA says is as follows:-

 

"There is no complete list of all US casualties from the war, though I do know two individuals that claim to have assembled them. Neither has come forward with them though. As for those who are definitely and officially MIA, our website list is the single most accurate record. No unit history, state or county book, or record kept at the time is likely to be 100% accurate either, as paperwork was much harder to gather and maintain at that time. This means that you may not find these men 'officially' listed anywhere and especially with any ABMC records as the ABMC did not retain care of them. To be included on an ABMC list the remains must have been entrusted to them, or in the case of the missing their names as such.

 

A man who was killed in action was buried where, or near where, he fell, usually by men of his own unit. After the war, Graves Registration Service went out to gather them into concentration points. The largest of these became the main US cemeteries from WW1 overseas. Following Memorial Day 1921 the government gave families the option to repatriate the remains of their loved one at government expense. Nearly 75% of soldier remains were shipped home, to be buried as the family saw fit. The rest remain in US cemeteries overseas cared for in perpetuity. The names of the missing are inscribed on the Tablets of the MIssing in the cemetery associated the closest with the area of action during which they disappeared. A large percentage of these men are missing simply because after the war the GRS were unable to locate their graves. The government kept very accurate records and continued to search for the men until 1934."

Home | Doughboymia

 

As you can read, these boys are still actively searching for WW1 US MIAs and are planning an expedition in autumn 2021.

Edited 13 April , 2021 by Hugh Shipman