Cap Badge ID.

[Rusty2727]

Hi all,

 

This is a long shot due to the quality of the image but can anyone help with the I.D of the cap badge on the attached image?

This photo fell out of my grandfathers brothers WW2 album that ive had for over 25yrs but never noticed this photo before.

The uniform looks more WW1 to me and certainly not a RAF photo which my great uncle was in during WW2.

My suspicion is it might be either a George Herbert Billington, who my great uncle was named after (Herbert George) or Walter

Cordwell Billington.

So any help with the cap badge would help me narrow down the search if i can identify the cap badge to a Regiment.

 

Many thanks

Russ

[Wardog]

Wiltshire Regiment and the shape of the cap looks to be of the type worn after the Great War- so could be 1920s up to early World War 2. Regards, Paul. PS not impossible for someone to serve in the Army then later in the RAF.

[Rusty2727]

This is strange, the photo came out of my granddads brothers album (Herbert George) he was born in 1921 and only served in the RAF in WW2.

the photo has on the bottom written in ink (Me)

The though was it might be his uncle who he was named after (George Herbert).

The family originate from Liverpool so i cant work out who would have been in the Wiltshire Regt.

Bit of a mystery really!

 

[FROGSMILE]

Definitely Wiltshire Regiment.  He has the appearance of a Boy soldier and seems to be wearing a canvas fatigue jacket.  I recognise the stairs behind him as the type that led to the upper storey in brick built Army barracks from that period.

Edited 24 January , 2021 by FROGSMILE

[Rusty2727]

Thank you Frogsmile, great to see the cap badge!....in your opinion is this uniform of WW1 vintage?....I really have no idea who this young lad could be!

[FROGSMILE]

43 minutes ago, Rusty2727 said:

Thank you Frogsmile, great to see the cap badge!....in your opinion is this uniform of WW1 vintage?....I really have no idea who this young lad could be!

It looks post war to me, he appears to be wearing the new specification cap from 1922, so he was probably a boy soldier between the wars.  Units ceased having boys on their establishment around 1924 and from then on they were concentrated in boys battalions at selected locations so that better facilities could be arranged for them.  It seems likely that he was perhaps one of the last cohorts to still be training on-the-job with his regiment. 

Edited 25 January , 2021 by FROGSMILE

[Rusty2727]

So would this be common place for a young lad to join the Wiltshire Regiment at this time even though he was from and lived in Liverpool?

I'm trying to work out how a Liverpool lad would have joined the Wiltshire's and not a local Regiment, like the Kings for instance.

 

You even see the word Liverpool written in black ink on the back section. Seems very strange to me..

[FROGSMILE]

4 hours ago, Rusty2727 said:

So would this be common place for a young lad to join the Wiltshire Regiment at this time even though he was from and lived in Liverpool?

I'm trying to work out how a Liverpool lad would have joined the Wiltshire's and not a local Regiment, like the Kings for instance.

 

You even see the word Liverpool written in black ink on the back section. Seems very strange to me..

When joining the Army it was very common to send young men to whichever unit was most in need of recruits unless they arrived with a strong claim to a particular regiment.  Many lads arrived at recruiting stations just saying they wanted to join the Army, without necessarily knowing a great deal about regiments.
 

It’s also clear that he is a Boy Entrant and back then each battalion had a set establishment for boys, so he would have been sent to a regiment with vacancies in its establishment of boys.  There was nothing unusual about that.  He is definitely Wiltshire Regiment and wearing a denim fatigue uniform that replaced the previous canvas pattern.

Edited 28 January , 2021 by FROGSMILE

[Rusty2727]

Very interesting, thank you very much for the information!...i don't think any of my remaining family even new he had been in the army as he joined

the RAF at the outbreak of WW2.

His brother, my grandfather who raised me from birth never spoke of him having been in the army, just the RAF.

so a rather interesting new bit of family history. i guess i will have to track down his records.

 

Thank you Frogsmile,

your input is very much appreciated.

 

Russ.

[FROGSMILE]

3 minutes ago, Rusty2727 said:

Very interesting, thank you very much for the information!...i don't think any of my remaining family even new he had been in the army as he joined

the RAF at the outbreak of WW2.

His brother, my grandfather who raised me from birth never spoke of him having been in the army, just the RAF.

so a rather interesting new bit of family history. i guess i will have to track down his records.

 

Thank you Frogsmile,

your input is very much appreciated.

 

Russ.

I’m glad to help Russ.  Because he enlisted after 1920 then in theory his service record should still exist and be held at the Army Personnel Records Office, Kentigern House, Glasgow.  As a Boy Entrant he was required to have the written permission of his parents or guardians to join as he was a minor.  This was a standard requirement.  He might well have only completed a short service engagement.

Edited 28 January , 2021 by FROGSMILE

[Rusty2727]

Oh wow, thats even more intriguing, as his father was ex KLR during WW1 and had a very bad time as they all did bu being gassed and becoming a POW. My grandfather told me his father was dead set against any of them joining any of the services for WW2 so the fact he would have needed written permission from a parent/parents

is very interesting indeed!

But thank you for the details of the Army Personnel Records Office.Thats very helpful!

 

Kindest regards

Russ

[FROGSMILE]

On 28/01/2021 at 14:10, Rusty2727 said:

Oh wow, thats even more intriguing, as his father was ex KLR during WW1 and had a very bad time as they all did bu being gassed and becoming a POW. My grandfather told me his father was dead set against any of them joining any of the services for WW2 so the fact he would have needed written permission from a parent/parents

is very interesting indeed!

But thank you for the details of the Army Personnel Records Office.Thats very helpful!

 

Kindest regards

Russ

Boy entrants to the infantry had the opportunity to learn one of four trades/specialisms, drummer, musician, shoe making, tailoring.  He might well have served just his minimum engagement and then been discharged with a trade.  Perhaps his father knew that.  One would assume so if he signed his permission.

Edited 23 November , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]

2 hours ago, Rusty2727 said:

Oh wow, thats even more intriguing, as his father was ex KLR during WW1 and had a very bad time as they all did bu being gassed and becoming a POW. My grandfather told me his father was dead set against any of them joining any of the services for WW2 so the fact he would have needed written permission from a parent/parents

is very interesting indeed!

But thank you for the details of the Army Personnel Records Office.Thats very helpful!

 

Kindest regards

Russ

Here is the address link for service record applications: https://www.gov.uk/get-copy-military-service-records

[Rusty2727]

Thank you buddy!....very much appreciated!