RNAS / RAF medals

[Allan1892]

Can anyone tell me what medals would have been awarded to RNAS / RAF ground crew?

[horatio2]

Any RNAS man who completed a minimumof 28 days mobilised service (anywhere) was qualified for the Brittish War Medal. Army (and RAF?) rules were different.

The Victory Medal was awarded to all RNAS who embarked on active service at sea, or on land in a Theatre of Operations.

[headgardener]

Standard campaign medals assuming they served abroad during the appropriate time periods (14 star, 14/15 star, BWM, VM, MSM, MM, possibly DCM). 

 

Assuming you're asking about HS personnel, I think the rules for RNAS were slightly different to RAF. There was no possibility for them to receive either of the campaign stars, RNAS men only had to complete 28 days service in order to receive a BWM ( no VM), while RFC / RAF men had to leave the shores of the UK in order to qualify (therefore no entitlement to HS ground crew). 

 

EDIT : I think the BWM and possibly the VM were awarded to the next of kin of HS men who died or were killed. 

Edited 22 September , 2020 by headgardener

[Allan1892]

T

 Thank you both. My man was in the RNAS and then the RAF (1.4.18) serving in Italy for a lot more than 28 days (see my posting under 'Air Personnel and the War in the Air' -- Horatio2 kindly replied to that). It would appear that he would have qualified for the BWM and the VM.

 

Thank you.

[headgardener]

It should show entitlement on his RAF service record. Yes, he'd receive a BW&VM assuming he didn't qualify for a star. 

[headgardener]

As an aside, if his service abroad occurred after the formation of the RAF then he'd have a 'split issue' - BWM named with his RNAS services details and VM named with his RAF details. 

[horatio2]

Per Armiralty Medal Roll, V and BWM in this case both issued by the Air Ministry.

[sdparker]

Pleased this thread has been started, as I was going to ask similar question.

Do any medals have RNAS details engraved on them- as opposed to RAF?

My grandfather was in the RNAS No F(20)2358, enlisting in November 1914.

Both his VM and BWM are engraved RAF. He was entitled to the 14/15 Star,

but does not appear to have received it-would it have been engraved with

RNAS details?

Regards

Geoff

[horatio2]

I believe medals issued by the Admiralty have RNAS details, as shown in the Admiralty Medal Roll. For those RNAS men who transferred to the RAF, their Air Ministry issued medals have RAF details. The Admiralty Medal Roll shows that Francis George Parker F..2358 was entitled to a trio of medals but he never claimed them and theyr were not issued. Admiralty medals had to be claimed or they were not issued. Since he never put in a claim the roll does not have any annotation of V and BWM being issued by the Air Ministry.

[headgardener]

31 minutes ago, sdparker said:

Pleased this thread has been started, as I was going to ask similar question.

Do any medals have RNAS details engraved on them- as opposed to RAF?

My grandfather was in the RNAS No F(20)2358, enlisting in November 1914.

Both his VM and BWM are engraved RAF. He was entitled to the 14/15 Star,

but does not appear to have received it-would it have been engraved with

RNAS details?

Regards

Geoff

 

Yes, see my previous response on this thread. 

 

Your g'fathers medals would have been a 'split issue' - his star would have been named with his RNAS details, and if he continued to serve overseas with the RAF then his BW&VM would be issued with his RAF details. 

 

I see Horatio has just responded as I was typing this...... 

 

EDIT: Did you say you have his BW&VM? Seems they weren't issued! You described them as being 'engraved' but the naming on officially issued medals was impressed rather than engraved. 

 

Edited 22 September , 2020 by headgardener

[sdparker]

Horatio 2  and Headgardener thanks for your replies clarifying the separate issue of medals by The Admiralty

and The RAF. Also finding out that he did not claim them. Does that mean a 14/15 Star exists somewhere with

his name on it?

Now to answer the other questions raised by this information from what I know.

He was in the RAFVR and was called up in 1938/9 and served in WW2in the UK and Burma. After WW2 he 

remained in the reserve and helped set up and run 2235 ATC Sqdn until 1955.

He did a lot of ceremonies, including standard bearer at The RAF Association at The Royal Albert Hall in 1949.

The medal group that he wore at this time had a WW1 trio of erased medals, presumably purchased to fill the 

gap. I found a copy of a letter to RAF Innsworth claiming his original medals, written in 1977? -just 3 years before

he died. I also found among his possessions the WW1 VM and BWM, which presumably were issued on receipt of 

his letter. These are RAF as stated earlier, and were in white cardboard boxes with the crown on , and medal details

hand written on the underside. I have therefore replaced the erased medals on his medal bar with the named ones.

I assume these are original, but could they be replicas as only issued in 1977?

Regards

Geoff

[headgardener]

Hi Geoff - the medal rolls that Horatio quoted in his earlier post are the original rolls created by the RN in 1919. They show that his medals weren't issued by the RN. The RAF medal rolls are not in the public domain. 

 

So.... His star was due to be issued by the RN, but he never claimed it. Therefore, when he did eventually write to RAF Innsworth in about 1980 they issued the BW&VM that he was entitled to in respect of his RAF service, but they weren't entitled to issue a 1915 star in respect of his RN service - he would have had to write to the RN in order to claim his 1915 star. His star doesn't exist because he never claimed it. 

 

I hope that makes sense! 

Edited 23 September , 2020 by headgardener

[horatio2]

I agree with HG.

Admiralty-issue medals were only named when claimed. They cannot now be claimed.

[sdparker]

Gentlemen, many thanks for your efforts to find the answers to my questions.

My grandfather obviously had a reason for not claiming his medals at the time, as did many others.

His mother died while he was stationed at Furnes in Belgium, as the squadron was about to move to 

The Somme to support the RFC, and my aunt told me that he was denied compassionate leave to see

her. This may have been the reason.

My mind is at rest now that I know there is no 14/15 Star out there

Thanks again

Geoff