Trying to find Walter Hebblewhite 10th Battalion Lincolnshire Regiment

[Deb77777]

Trying to find any information about my great-grandfathers brother Pte Walter Hebblewhite No 18947 who died WW1 on (11) or 12/8/1917 of wounds. He is buried in Roisel Communal Cemetery Extension in France. He was born in Dunholme, Lincoln. It says he was 23 years old when he died but not quite sure that is right. Where would he have been fighting, and could he have been injured before this date but just died then. If so it would be hard to tie down where he was injured. Also although from Lincoln i understand the regiment is known as the Grimsby Chums even though he wasn't from Grimsby. Anyone that has any info on the regiment at the time and Walter himself i would be very grateful.Thanks

Edited 5 March , 2020 by Deb77777

[charlie962]

Welcome to the Forum Deb,

 

On Findmypast there is a hospital Admission (Scabies) for Feb 1917 stating that he was 10th Bn, had completed 1y 6mths service and had been in the field 3 months. Aged 23 at that date.

 

It is most probable that he died of wounds within a day or so of being wounded. I note the Pension Card (on Fold3) says he died of Shrapnel wounds.

 

The 1901 Census says he was 7 years old thus 1894 birth +/-

The 1911 Census has him as 17

Edited 5 March , 2020 by charlie962

[Deb77777]

thank you so much for that info. Was the hospital admission in UK? I now need to try and find out where his battalion was roughly around this death date. It mentioned in a site about ......May and June 1917 saw the Lincolns again in the Arras sector, not far from Perrone. In August they were to attack the Hindenburg line taking the Germans by surprise, before being withdrawn again.

Thank you

[charlie962]

1 minute ago, Deb77777 said:

Was the hospital admission in UK?

No. As I said He had been in the field 3 months.

 

I will look up the war diary link for the period.

 

Charlie

[Deb77777]

excellent work!!!! its making me itch! Wish people had kept photos and things from this awful time. I am trying to keep a box of everything i find out about Walter and other members of my family that have been involved in WW1 and WW2. Hopefully one day these records can be useful to someone. My grown up children don't seem to be taking too much interest at present but maybe as they mature a bit more they will.

[charlie962]

If you have Ancestry the War Diary for 10th lincolnshire starts here

 

Note that it is rare for War Diaries to mention names of other ranks.

 

Charlie

[Deb77777]

thank you

[charlie962]

page 127 of the war diary summarises casualties in the first part of the month to 14/8/17 as

Officers - 2 wounded

ORS     - 3 killed or died of wounds

ORs    -   7 wounded

 

There is a bit of general narrative in the previous couple of pages covering the period 10th to 14th Aug 1917 when the Battalion took over a new bit of the Frontline trenches. It is most probably in this period Walter was hit. There is an excellent map of the line in Appendix A of that month. It shows all the company positions but unfortunately we don't yet know which Company Walter was in.

[charlie962]

Deb,

You should also check the various CWGC reports backing up the Grave Registration. Walter's original Grave was marked but when the CWGC came to concentrate the burial site they did not find any remains and thus he has a special 'Kipling' memorial. Forum Pals can explain this better than I.

eg:

Edited 5 March , 2020 by charlie962

[Deb77777]

wow what a great thing to read Charlie, thank you

[Deb77777]

oh thats what it means, i had read "Kipling" but didn't understand. I had read in about the 3 D.O.W and presumed that one of them would be Walter. What a great insight into their everyday life!

[charlie962]

Here is an old map showing Hargicourt which appears in that appendix A map and Roisel, where he is buried. Not far away.

 

 

 

6 minutes ago, Deb77777 said:

had read in about the 3 D.O.W

3 killed or died of wounds.

 

There was fierce fighting in the area subsequently (see CWGC's history of the Cemetery) and thus a known marked grave can become obliterated before the war ended.

 

Charlie

Edited 5 March , 2020 by charlie962

[charlie962]

I suspect these are the 3 men died from 10th Lincolns (I searched CWGC for 10th lincolns between 1 and 14/8/17)

 

Note that they all died same day and that one other has a memorial because his actual grave was lost.

 

 

It might be worth researching the other two in case they have a newspaper obit or something that throws a bit more light on Walter's fate.

 

Anyway you have a bit to go on now. Do come back with lots of questions !

 

Charlie

 

 

Edited 6 March , 2020 by charlie962
spellink mishtakes

[Deb77777]

Excellent Charlie!!!!!!!! If they were all killed same day and same area is there a reason why Walter would be in a different Cemetery?  

[charlie962]

On 05/03/2020 at 15:44, Deb77777 said:

f they were all killed same day and same area is there a reason why Walter would be in a different Cemetery?  

Evacuation of wounded as oposed to being killed immediately means that he might have been at the regimental aid post (RAP) or Field Ambulance (FA) at the time of death and then it would be burial at the nearest cemetery.

 

charlie

[toofatfortakeoff]

I think Walter is mentioned in Chris and Steve Bradley’s book of the 5th Lincolns 

[Deb77777]

really , wow thank you for that

[Deb77777]

can't find the book, does it have a title please?

 

[Deb77777]

Yes, got it Chris and Steve Bramley, thank you

 

[Deb77777]

Would he be in a book about the 5th regiment Lincolns when his death certificate said he was in the 10Th Battalion Lincoln's?

[toofatfortakeoff]

That's the one 

[temptage]

 

 

[Deb77777]

Great!!!!! Where would i find this gravestone for Walter? Its such a shame that it was a Kipling memorial at Roisel Cemetery, his family must have been very upset. Thank you so much for this

[Michelle Young]

Walters special memorial headstone ( also known as a Kipling memorial) is at Roisel Communal Cemetery Extension. It is a symbolic stone, not his actual grave, which as the stone says, was lost in later fighting. 

[Deb77777]

Would the above gravestone for Walter be in Roisel Cemetery as it says "killed in action and at the time was buried in Roisel Cemetery".  ? Thank you