Receipt of MM riband and medals

[konks]

My great uncle was presented with the medal riband for his Military Medal and bar at a parade in France in January1918. But when would he have received the actual silver medal? [There is no reference to his MM on his medal card so no hints there.]

[Coldstreamer]

welcome to the forum

nice medal - who is the man in question?

you could check local papers to see if there is any reference or the war diary  - both can be a bit hit and miss

[rksimpson]

11 hours ago, konks said:

My great uncle was presented with the medal riband for his Military Medal and bar at a parade in France in January1918. But when would he have received the actual silver medal? [There is no reference to his MM on his medal card so no hints there.]

Hi

 

MM is on a separate card, see here - https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/british-army-medal-index-cards-1914-1920/

 

regards

 

Robert

[Chris_Baker]

It was normal practice for the riband to be presented to the man fairly soon after the MM was internally announced. He would be given the choice of receiving the actual medal by post or by presentation. The documents to do with the latter sometimes appear in men's service records. I have yet to see one dated before 1919.

[konks]

On 09/02/2020 at 20:00, Coldstreamer said:

welcome to the forum

nice medal - who is the man in question?

you could check local papers to see if there is any reference or the war diary  - both can be a bit hit and miss

He was Stk 1857 of 10th Battalion Royal Fusiliers. The award of the MM is recorded in the War Diary of the Battalion. Not sure whether the local paper in Antigua, West Indies reported medals of men who had volunteered to go to Europe. In any case, what I am trying to find out is when the actual medal would have been sent/presented to him.

In the recent film 1917 one of the soldiers says that he has swapped his medal for a bottle of wine. This seemed unlikely as I am pretty sure that the medals were not presented on the field just the ribands/ribbons. 

Edited 12 February , 2020 by konks

[konks]

On 10/02/2020 at 11:36, Chris_Baker said:

It was normal practice for the riband to be presented to the man fairly soon after the MM was internally announced. He would be given the choice of receiving the actual medal by post or by presentation. The documents to do with the latter sometimes appear in men's service records. I have yet to see one dated before 1919.

Thanks. L/Corporal Duke received his riband on 28 October 1917 for the action which took place between 27 Sept and 6 October 1917 according to the War Diary. He received a bar to his MM on 25 January 1918 but no record of the action in which he achieved it. It may be that he actually received the ribands for the MM and bar at the same time.

Edited 12 February , 2020 by konks
Spelling + date of award

[charlie962]

Konks

Just a note that he was previously wounded early 1917, perhaps February, because he appears in the Daily Casualty List published 12/3/17

 

I note the medal Roll for the BWM (there are 2 re BWI service , and for BWM/VM 1) states trf'd to 31st Royal Fusiliers 9/1/16. The BWM/VM Roll says he was only serving France with 10th Bn RF

 

Charlie

Edited 12 February , 2020 by charlie962

[konks]

Charlie- Are you sure we are talking about the same soldier - Oriel St.Arnaud Duke? His medal card only shows that he first joined the British West India Regiment and then the 10th.

 

I’ve never heard of the daily casualty list - was this done on a regimental basis? How can I access it?

[Coldstreamer]

On line sites such as FMP have these lists as well as some local papers

they cane be a bit of a jumble but on the whole listed regimentally

[charlie962]

6 hours ago, konks said:

Charlie- Are you sure we are talking about the same soldier - Oriel St.Arnaud Duke? His medal card only shows that he first joined the British West India Regiment and then the 10th.

Yes. I am only repeating the information that appears on the original documents. Be aware that the Medal Roll was used to initiate the Medal Index Card and may contain additional info and should always be examined.

 

You know he was BWI  1139

 

The Medal Roll on Ancestry has three sheets for him. They got confused ! The Medal Index Card notes duplication.

These are the hits on Ancestry.

 

If you look at the record itself you will see that on one of them it notes his transfer to 31st Royal Fusiliers 9/1/16. Note also that the 2 BWI entries just refer to the British War Medal and it is the RF roll that shows his entitlement to the Victory Medal.

 

The LongLongTrail here will tell you that the 31st RF were a Reserve Battalion in UK.

 

So you can presume that having started with the BWI in 1915, Duke was transferred to the 31st Royal Fusiliers in UK in Jan 1916 before, at some stage, being posted to France to join the 10th Bn (who had been in France since July 1915).

 

The Casualty lists won't give you any more information than I've posted. The list that day was brief and includes RF men from other Bns.

Here is the actual extract of the List dated 12th March 1917 (courtesy the Genealogist but you may find it on FindmyPast)

As I said in my previous post, the actual wounding was probably c 12th Feb 1917 or earlier. The War Diary doesn't show mention of casualties at this time but that doesn't mean he wasn't one!

 

I hope this is a bit clearer. Do ask if further explanation needed;

 

Charlie

Edited 13 February , 2020 by charlie962