12th Battalion King's Royal Rifle Corps

[reevo6825]

Hi, I'm new to the forum sand hope I can get a couple of pointers.

 

I'm helping my father-in-law research his family tree. His grandfather was Private R-25859 Arthur PAIN who served with the 12th Battalion King's Royal Rifle Corps from 11/12/1915 until he was discharged due to his wounds on 07/05/1918.

 

His great uncle was Private R/11832 James PAIN who served with the same Battalion from 17/04/1915 until he was killed in France on 08/10/1918.

 

On Wikipedia I read that the 12th Battalion was a 'service' battalion and was also known as the 'Queen's Westminster Rifles' but elsewhere I've read they were a regiment in their own right. I know the 12th Battn. were one of those that was formed for the war but can anyone tell me where I can find out more about them and details of their role and the actions they participated in.

 

Where might I find out more about where an individual was wounded or died?

 

I've seen some old KRRC cap badges for sale and one had a red cloth backing sheet. Would the different battalions have had different colours? If so, any idea what colour the 12th were?

 

Thank you in advance for any replies.

 

Regards

Paul Reeves

[kenf48]

Welcome to the forum,

 

Suggest you have a look at the Long Long Trail for hints on how to research a soldier here is the page on the KRRC

https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-british-infantry-regiments-of-1914-1918/kings-royal-rifle-corps/

 

The service record of James Pain has survived, he was serving with the 1st Battalion when he was killed. He had previously been wounded while serving with the 12th and was posted to the 1st Bn when he was sent back to France.  He first joined the 12th Battalion in France  on the 3rd October 1915.

 

 You can read the record on Ancestry or Find My Past (both offer a free trial or your local library may subscribe to the Library Edition). 

 

His death is recorded on the CWGC Roll of Honour https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/587009/pain,-/

 

Unfortunately Arthur’s record has apparently not survived so it will take longer to piece together his service. His medal entitlement was the British War Medal and Victory Medal which means he did not go to France until after the 31December 1915.  His service was with the 12th Battalion.  It looks as though he attested under the Derby or Group Scheme in December 1915 and was called up for service, or mobilised June 1916 and probably posted to the 6th Battalion at Sheerness.  If aged over 18 he would have been posted to the 12th Battalion around three months or so later.

 

’Service’ simply means the Battalion was formed for war service.  The Queens Westminster Rifles was the 1/16th Battalion of the London Regiment, a Rifle Battalion but not KRRC.

 

Ken

I don’t do uniforms.

[reevo6825]

On 27/01/2020 at 00:06, kenf48 said:

Welcome to the forum,

 

Suggest you have a look at the Long Long Trail for hints on how to research a soldier here is the page on the KRRC

https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-british-infantry-regiments-of-1914-1918/kings-royal-rifle-corps/

 

The service record of James Pain has survived, he was serving with the 1st Battalion when he was killed. He had previously been wounded while serving with the 12th and was posted to the 1st Bn when he was sent back to France.  He first joined the 12th Battalion in France  on the 3rd October 1915.

 

 You can read the record on Ancestry or Find My Past (both offer a free trial or your local library may subscribe to the Library Edition). 

 

His death is recorded on the CWGC Roll of Honour https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/587009/pain,-/

 

Unfortunately Arthur’s record has apparently not survived so it will take longer to piece together his service. His medal entitlement was the British War Medal and Victory Medal which means he did not go to France until after the 31December 1915.  His service was with the 12th Battalion.  It looks as though he attested under the Derby or Group Scheme in December 1915 and was called up for service, or mobilised June 1916 and probably posted to the 6th Battalion at Sheerness.  If aged over 18 he would have been posted to the 12th Battalion around three months or so later.

 

’Service’ simply means the Battalion was formed for war service.  The Queens Westminster Rifles was the 1/16th Battalion of the London Regiment, a Rifle Battalion but not KRRC.

 

Ken

I don’t do uniforms.

Thank you for the very full and prompt reply and my apologies for not being able to respond sooner. Very useful info and with your advice I have found a record of his wounding and death on 08/10/1918 (the day before his 43rd birthday)! I've also found the record of his burial in France with two other KRRC Riflemen who died in the same action.

 

Much obliged.

Paul

[Ivor Anderson]

An overview of the 12th KRRC's WW1 history can be found here: https://wartimememoriesproject.com/greatwar/allied/battalion.php?pid=6485

Photos of graves of two MM winners of the Bn. are here: https://rememberourdeadregimentallist.weebly.com/12th-battalion-kings-royal-rifle-corps.html

The LG of 3rd June 1916 has 4 MMs to the 12th KRRC (they are listed in the WD at the end of June 1916 - probably retrospective awards):

                 Cpl. Joseph French R4184,   Cpl. T. A. Plant 645,   R6159 L/C C. W. Smith,   and A2983 Pte. George A. White.

12th KRRC war diary: https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7353111

Edited 17 April , 2022 by Ivor Anderson

[Bordercollie]

On 26/01/2020 at 22:19, reevo6825 said:

On Wikipedia I read that the 12th Battalion was a 'service' battalion and was also known as the 'Queen's Westminster Rifles' but elsewhere I've read they were a regiment in their own right. I know the 12th Battn. were one of those that was formed for the war but can anyone tell me where I can find out more about them and details of their role and the actions they participated in.

 

It is probably worth pointing out that the Queen's Westminster Rifles was not the 12th Battalion King's Royal Rifle Corps in World War 1.  As you have found 12th Battalion King's Royal Rifle Corps was raised for World War 1 as part of Kitchener's expansion of the Regular Army.  The Queen's Westminster Rifles was a unit of the Territorial Army and served in World War 1 as the 16th Battalion London Regiment.  The London Regiment ceased to exist in 1937 and the Queen's Westminsters became a Territorial Army battalion of the King's Royal Rifle Corps. Initially it retained the title Queen's Westminsters  but in 1941 the 2nd Queen's Westminsters became 12th Battalion King's Royal Rifle Corps.  By that time of course the 12th Battalion that had been raised in world War 1 had long since been disbanded. 

[reevo6825]

Thank you for taking the time to let me know that 👍

[Ivor Anderson]

Arthur Pain's medal index card on Ancestry shows he got a silver war badge (SWB) to recognise he was discharged due to wounds:

Arthur enlisted 11th Dec 1915 and was discharged 7th May 1918 with SWB no. 391561, aged 35.

Edited 17 April , 2022 by Ivor Anderson

[Ivor Anderson]

James Pain's MIC shows he entered France on 1st Oct 1915 and was KIA - killed in action:

NB James was with the 1st Bn KRRC when he died - not the 12th https://www.cwgc.org/find-records/find-war-dead/casualty-details/587009/j-pain/

 

Edited 17 April , 2022 by Ivor Anderson

[Ivor Anderson]

Judging by the casualties quoted,  it looks likely that Arthur Pain was wounded during the 'German Spring Offensive' from 21st March 1918. War diary at end of March:

[Matlock1418]

On 26/01/2020 at 22:19, reevo6825 said:

His grandfather was Private R-25859 Arthur PAIN who served with the 12th Battalion King's Royal Rifle Corps from 11/12/1915 until he was discharged due to his wounds on 07/05/1918.

At WFA/Fold3 there is a Pension Index Card

Image courtesy of WFA/Fold3

Arthur PAIN, 25859, KRR 12th Bn

This would have been the index card for the start of his post-discharge disability pension claim.

Discharged 7-5-18

Original pension claim reference SDG 5781, later changed to 11/M/170048

27/6 [pw] for 8.5.18 to 26.5.18 was the rate for 100% disability but the period for which it is awarded is rather short.  It does not much help identifying the injury(ies) and the change in case reference rather belies a likely extension beyond those dates - so rather looks like a temporary payment. 

CNVQ2B3303 I think is his personal identity certificate number - so he could claim his pension payment(s) at a Post Office.

Unfortunately his main pension file is likely long deliberately destroyed after its use was ended.

The DEAD, 3.11.24 indicates the claim was considered dead by then [not necessarily at the death of the man on or before, but of course that event would end a disability pension claim]

Pensions guru @ss002d6252 may perhaps be able to offer more interpretation/explanation, especially/hopefully on the quantum and short period of the award indicated on the card.

M

[ss002d6252]

40 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said:

Original pension claim reference SDG 5781, later changed to 11/M/170048

The SDG 5781 number was the Pension Issue Office number - his original pension number was C(helsea) N(umber) VQ2B 3303.

Craig

[Matlock1418]

23 minutes ago, ss002d6252 said:

The SDG 5781 number was the Pension Issue Office number

23 minutes ago, ss002d6252 said:

his original pension number was VQ2B 3303.

Thank you for your interpretation

Puzzled by CN VQ2B 3303 - I'd read the CN as Certificate Number, for his personal ID.  I live and learn.

M

Edit: I note your edit which now makes the CN much clearer. 

Edited 17 April , 2022 by Matlock1418
Edit

[ss002d6252]

There was definitely a claim past May 1918 as something was happening to generate the later regional reference code.

It might be a special temporary allowance whilst his claim was being sorted. That was paid at 27s 6d.

Craig

[Ivor Anderson]

Thanks Craig & M. Those should help the OP in his search.

This is the MM of Pte. George White A2983 of 12th KRRC from the 3 June 1916 LG - note the C instead of G on his MM:

Edited 18 April , 2022 by Ivor Anderson