maudson Posted 9 December , 2019 Share Posted 9 December , 2019 I have just started on five men from Ringstead with the surname Sawford. The first is Arthur Sawford, born 1896. The Roll of Honour states that he was in Salonica and Egypt and was with the 21st Battery of the RFA - and was invalided home and demobilised. His Medal Card shows that he was with RFA with No. 11412 and then ASC with No. 390437. He was sick twice, first with Debility at No, 2 Convalescent Depot on 26/11/1916 and secondly, with Malaria at No. 28 Casualty Clearing Station. I have found information about 28 CCS in Salonica but it appears to me that the 21st Field Battery was always on the Western Front/. 211 Field Battery RFA, however, was in Salonica as part of 67 Brigade RFA. Should I assume a typing error or have I missed something? As always any suggestions welcome. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 9 December , 2019 Share Posted 9 December , 2019 (edited) The transcribed record on FWR has some errors. The record is of the 28 Gen Hosp not 28CCS in Salonica. The original says C Battery 100th Brigade RFA. That was 22nd Division so definitely in Salonica. The first record you refer to is also a Salonica admission. This is also 28GH. This one has him as D Battery 100th Brigade RFA FMP has original admission registers http://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-royal-artillery-in-the-first-world-war/batteries-and-brigades-of-the-royal-field-artillery/xcviii-xcix-c-ci-howitzer-brigades-22nd-divisional-artillery/ Shows details regarding 100th Brigade His RFA number was 114121. 1 on the end. And T/390437 Discharged 19/3/19 and got a pension for malaria. Also had an exophthalmic goitre. pension Card source. suspect he is the Arthur Sawford born 3/8/1895 and died 8/9/1981.unusual name so pretty certain. 1939 list has him working as a Boot operative. Careful as another man with same name in the Northants but he was born 1883 or thereabouts. Medal pair only. No in theatre service before start of 1916. The first med record from 1916 says 8 months in field force so overseas from Mar- Apr 1916 if that is accurate. Also say 1year 4 months in service. So enlistment July-ish 1915. The latter record from March 1917 says 1y 2m with field force and 1y 10m in service. Suggesting earlier move overseas and slightly earlier enlistment. Edited 9 December , 2019 by Mark1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maudson Posted 9 December , 2019 Author Share Posted 9 December , 2019 Mark Many thanks for the detailed corrected information. I will need to absorb it before I post again. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clk Posted 9 December , 2019 Share Posted 9 December , 2019 Hi David, 2 hours ago, Mark1959 said: The first med record from 1916 says 8 months in field force so overseas from Mar- Apr 1916 if that is accurate. Also say 1year 4 months in service. So enlistment July-ish 1915. I think there may be a question mark over the length of his overall service/enlistment date. There are some surviving service papers for some 'near number' RFA men which show... 114118 Taylor - joined at Woolwich 19.10.1915, attested and posted #4 Depot (Woolwich) 18.10.1915 114121 114127 Magee - joined at Woolwich 20.10.1915, attested and posted #4 Depot (Woolwich) 19.10.1915 114144 Taylor - joined at Woolwich 21.10.1915, attested and posted #4 Depot (Woolwich) 18.10.1915 By looking for surviving service papers for some 'near number' ASC men to his T/390437, you may be able to date his transfer. For example T/390430 Smith appears to have been a compulsory transfer from the RFA on 19.1.1918. Regards Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maudson Posted 9 December , 2019 Author Share Posted 9 December , 2019 Hi Chris and Mark, I am struggling a little with this. Would I be right in thinking that he first went to the 21st Reserve Battery RFA which was part of 4a Reserve Brigade at Woolwich. He was then posted (perhaps via Egypt which is shown on the Roll of Honour) to D Battery of the 100th Brigade and then C Battalion of 110th Brigade, both in Salonica. He had two sickness bouts both at 28th General Hospital, the second being Malaria and after being treated at 28th GH was sent back to England on the Hospital Ship Dover Castle. On recovery, he was transferred to the ASC, probably in early 1918.and may not have served abroad again, although without further information we cannot be sure. Please do criticise this summary if I have misunderstood your posts. Thanks again David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clk Posted 10 December , 2019 Share Posted 10 December , 2019 Hi David, I think that it is difficult to be certain about his service path. Having arrived in Woolwich, the papers for the other men show differing things. 114118 Taylor 114127 Magee 114144 Taylor All images sourced from Findmpast Regards Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin kenf48 Posted 10 December , 2019 Admin Share Posted 10 December , 2019 15 hours ago, maudson said: On recovery, he was transferred to the ASC, probably in early 1918.and may not have served abroad again, although without further information we cannot be sure. He was one of a number of previously wounded/sick men compulsorily transferred from the Reserve Brigade RFA at Blackheath to the ASC on the 20 January 1918 (Medal Roll). As you say we can't be sure but where records survive from this cohort they were sent to France. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 10 December , 2019 Share Posted 10 December , 2019 I have always been wary of service periods on the medical records. Chris’s analysis is much more likely to be correct. Also Chris’s near number check seems to put the men in Reserve Brigades pre serving overseas. Please note the medical records show 100th Brigade RFA in each case. The first admission for debility was with D Battery the second with C Battery. No primary evidence he was ever in 110 Brigade RFA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maudson Posted 10 December , 2019 Author Share Posted 10 December , 2019 Many thanks for all your informed corrections and comments. I took the 110th Brigade from the FWR transcript which Mark has now established is wrong, Again I need to work out in my own head what is a reasonable sequence so that I can at least tell of some of his army service. Generally the Roll of Honour has been accurate although some transfers etc happened after it had received information on a soldier.. I wonder, therefore, if he was transferred to the 21st Reserve Battery when he returned to England sick. After this he was transferred to the ASC. I may not be able to fill in any details of the ASC Service unless some family information comes through. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maudson Posted 14 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 14 January , 2020 Hi All, Just to say thanks fro everyone's help. I have now posted his story on my Ringstead People site. If you do take a look and find any mistakes I would be grateful if you let me know. Best Wishes David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clk Posted 15 January , 2020 Share Posted 15 January , 2020 Hi David, A couple of thoughts... His full ASC number was T/390437. The 'T/' prefix is indicative of serving as Horsed Transport - see here. I think that the medical records can't be relied on to confidently assert... The comparison of his 114121 RFA number seems to point towards a date of October 1915. Regards Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maudson Posted 15 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 15 January , 2020 Hi Chris Thanks again. I will alter my piece on the website. Thank you for taking the trouble to look at the biography and give amendments. I am very aware as to my limitations as a military historian. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now