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Robbie JN

Harry Nunn Trophy - HAC

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Robbie JN
Posted (edited)

I am not sure which is the best forum for this request so accept my apologies if this is in the wrong place.

I posted a message on the 'Who Do You Think You Are?' forums a while ago which went as follows:

 

About 15 years ago, the Honourable Artillery Company (HAC) had a different website to the one they have now, and on a page about their museum they had a photo of a 'Harry Nunn Trophy'. It depicted a man on a horse, if I remember correctly, and was wondering who he was. I had 2 relatives who were in the HAC with similar names, and was wondering if it was anything to do with either of them. I think the trophy may have originated around WW1, but who the man was may have been from an earlier time, I don't know.

My relatives:
Joshua Henry Nunn, born 1815, HAC member from the 1860s onwards. Reached at least the rank of Captain, won a shooting contest, whilst a Lieutenant, in August 1867 and had a portrait presented as a prize by its artist Private R St Leger Pigot. (Portrait is of Joshua.)
Robert Henry Nunn (son of Joshua), born 1842. Listed on British Army Lists on Ancestry as Lieutenant R H Nunn in 1882, and possibly got up to being a Major.

Given both men had the middle name 'Henry', maybe one of them was known as 'Harry'. This is possibly a bit of a stretch, but maybe someone can clarify who THE Harry Nunn, from the trophy, was and what they did in the HAC?

Thank you for any help you can provide with regard to this.

 

In addition in a subsequent post:

 

I have just found the printouts from 8-2-2004 and there is a caption with the trophy:

"One of the Harry Nunn memorial trophies commissioned by the Court after World War 1. The sculptor was L S Merrifield, who completed the work in 1928. It depicts a mounted artillery man who fought in the Middle Eastern campaign."

I don’t know if that helps at all with finding out who Harry Nunn was, but that’s all the information I have. I know there have been multiple Middle Eastern campaigns in the Army’s history, so which one this refers to, I don’t know.
Any suggestions?

Thanks for any help you can provide.


 

Edited by Robbie JN

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Dragoon
Posted (edited)

Hi Robbie JN,

I'd love to try and help but this a WW1 forum, sorry to pass you on from pillar to post, but i think you'll find the Victorian Wars forum more of a help, you can find them here...

https://www.victorianwars.com/

Hope this helps, and good luck in your findings, quite an intriguing story..

 

Chris

Edited by Dragoon

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Michelle Young

I'm afraid that as this is off topic for the GWF, it will have to be locked. Good luck in your research 

 

Michelle 

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Robbie JN

Sorry to temporarily unlock this thread, but the trophy was made after WW1.

I think there was a Middle Eastern Campaign in WW1, so I was hoping someone might know if it was related to someone called Harry Nunn who served in the HAC during WW1.

Obviously if that is true, then it is not the same man as the 2 relatives I mentioned, given the older one was dead and the younger one was retired from active service.

However, unless someone can give information one way or the other then it cannot be definitely confirmed that this is not a WW1 topic.

 

9 hours ago, Robbie JN said:

One of the Harry Nunn memorial trophies commissioned by the Court after World War 1. The sculptor was L S Merrifield, who completed the work in 1928. It depicts a mounted artillery man who fought in the Middle Eastern campaign

 

I am just trying to confirm things without ruling things out prematurely.

If someone can explain the trophy further, whereby it can be confirmed as a pre-WW1 event, then I can move on to another forum, otherwise it seems reasonable to continue to pursue this line a bit more.

 

Once again, thanks for the help.

 

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George Rayner

There is a tree on Ancestry...https://www.ancestry.com/family-tree/person/tree/10612823/person/6959329144/facts

William Robert Evelyn the son of a Henry Robert Nunn appears in the

Royal Marine Artillery 1880 Baptism list.

HR is listed in Census 1911 as a Bank pensioner but no military records attached.

No military evidence for father Joshua attached

 

George

 

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Robbie JN

Thank you for the link. 

Unfortunately, that family tree is incorrect, as Robert William Evelyn Nunn belongs to a different family, as his mother’s maiden name does not match. I checked that on the GRO website. Every other Nunn on that tree appears to be correct, just not that one. 

 

Did the HAC have mounted artillery men in WW1? 

If not then the WW1 era can be ruled out. 

 

Thanks again for the help. 

 

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Dragoon
Posted (edited)

Hello again, 

A bit premature on the thread lock, sorry! I can see where you are coming from now.

On FMP HAC records there is a 3619 Henry Joseph Nunn, I'm unable to see the records to see if he was HAC Artillery or infantry as I normally use library computers to get FMP free.

And yes, the HAC Artillery Batteries were mounted, they were Territorial Batteries of the Royal Horse Artillery, and had the titles HAC, RHA.

Hope this helps 

 

Chris 

 

Edited by Dragoon

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Robbie JN

Thanks for that info.

I have checked the CWGC website and found no Henry Nunn, Harry Nunn nor an H Nunn who died in WW1 whilst serving with the HAC.

(I do have another relative who died in 1917 whilst in the HAC and the CWGC does give his full name, including full middle name, so accurate personal details should not be a problem when checking records, with regard to the HAC.)

That was just in case the trophy was in honour of a soldier who died.

A 'memorial' trophy does not have to be for someone who actually died whilst in the Army, does it? They could have done something memorable, like won a medal for something, retired, then died as a civilian, possibly, hence no CWGC record.

 

Would the current people in charge of the HAC Museum know the answer to this? It was closed for re-development for several years and the photo is no longer on their website.

It seems to be more of a place to rent out for social functions rather than a proper museum, so employees are most likely events planners rather than curators.

 

Any more suggestions?

Thanks again for the continued help.

 

 

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George Rayner

Sorry thought as father Robert Henry and mother Fanny on baptism he was correct.

 

George

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PRC

As it's a trophy I would suspect named after an officer rather than an other rank, so following that angle I checked out a sample of Army Lists from the Great War era - December 1914. September 1916 and March 1918, (just ones I happen to have, nothing more scientific than that!). There is no Nunn listed.

 

However given it's pre-war status and it's social appeal there is a good chance that an HAC other-ranker might have received a war-time commission, served with other units during the war, retained his commission post-war but arranged to get himself transferred into the HAC following the contraction of the British Army post-war and the disbandment of so many wartime only units.

 

On that basis I checked out the Officers records for the surname Nunn in the Discovery catalogue at the National Archive. There are surviving records for 24 Officers with the surname Nunn. Looking for variations on Harry \ Henry \ Harold \ Harrold whittles it down to:-

2nd Lieutenant Harry Evison Nunn, Royal Fusiliers.

2nd Lieutenant Victor Harold Nunn, Royal Flying Corps

Major John Henry Nunn, Royal Field Artillery

Captain Charles Henry Napier Nunn, General List

Any of those could potentially have a link with the HAC.

 

Harry Evison Nunn appears to have survived the War and died in 1941.

Victor Harold Nunn appears to have survived the War and most likely died in 1955.

John Henry Nunn  died of wounds on the 1st April 1917 aged 32, whilst serving with "A" Battery, 149th Brigade, RFA and is buried at Warlincourt, France.

https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/91527/nunn,-/

Charles Henry Napier Nunn also appears to have survived the War. I couldn't identify a likely death for him, but while looking for more information it looks like he was involved in running his units very successful football team prior to the war.

https://britisharmyancestors.co.uk/blog/7-coy-army-service-corps/

So if the trophy was sports related it could even have been awarded for a competiton between units rather than within a Regiment and so the HAC may have been the last team to win it before the competiton was discontinued.

 

I wouldn't entirely rule out it being a long-serving N.C.O. or a wealthy other-ranker but I'd suggest exhausting the officer line of enquiry first.

 

Cheers,

Peter

 

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Robbie JN
Posted (edited)

Thank you all.

 

1 - To George, don't worry about that Ancestry tree, as it was the researcher who mistakenly thought that because the child had parents called Robert and Fanny, that he belonged to that family, despite the fact he was born in Hampshire, rather than London, and his father was a Marine rather than an Army soldier (reservist). I had to look it up and find another Robert Nunn marrying a Fanny just to be sure, the first time I saw it.

(Just to point out that R W E Nunn was born in Q4 1879 with mother's maiden name Harridane. A Robert Henry Nunn married a Fanny Harridane in Q1 1878 Essex. The correct Robert Henry Nunn married Fanny Maria Roberts in Q4 1870 in Middlesex. Daughter Maud/Maude was their only child as far as I can tell, so there was not a 3rd generation soldier in the HAC. Also, R H Nunn's brother Arthur Wellesley Nunn, I wonder who he was named after, had no children either.)

 

2 - To PRC, thanks for the research, I had forgotten to look up Harold, and its different spelling variations, on the CWGC website, which I have now done, with no results for the HAC.

A soldier could have won their medal, or carried out their heroic deed, etc, whilst in the HAC, then transferred to another regiment and died in action. So many things to consider.

 

Thanks again for all the help everyone.

 

 

Edited by Robbie JN

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George Rayner

Thanks...I too have suffered from others research in my family tree!

 

George

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