Snipers

[Landsturm]

I have a question that occurred in my mind when watching All Quiet on the Western Front`s sad end scene... Snipers` weaponry of choice;

Among the British, in the beginning there was a "freelance" period when British sniping was conducted on an individual basis, largely by officers with pre-war hunting experience who provided their own weaponry, meaning sporting rifles. The early dominance of no-man`s land by German snipers led to an official programme of sniper training from spring 1916. Trained sniper`s weapon was standard SMLE fitted with pre-war 2x power Lattey optical sights; these magnifying lenses, clipped to the front and rear sights, had a tiny field of vision and were not as effective as true telescopic sights, but were relatively cheap and available. Later on snipers were provided by the Lovat Scouts (a unit raised from Highland gamekeepers and deer stalkers). Camouflage suits were used widely. SMLE was now fitted with Periscopic Prism Company 2x power telescopic sight off-set to the left receiver (sometimes camouflaged with hessian strips). Sometimes even unreliable Ross M1905-rifles were used.

As for Germans I know less. In Germany the Duke of Ratibor is credited with initiating the collection of sporting weapons, and the Bavarians are believed to received their first telescopic rifles as early as December 1914. Standard being Scharfschützen Gewehr M98 with 3x power Zeiss telescopic sight.

And finally the question itself... what was the story on the French side?

[Julian Whippy]

Aside from Germany the only other country to enter the war with a telescopic mounted rifle was the USA ! They had the Springfiled M1903 and mounted on it the 5x power Warner Swasey prismatic scope. The M1903 was still in use by americans i believe well into the 1950's, so it must have been good. The BEF did use Canadian M1910 Ross's also with a Swasey sight. The Ross I understand was plagued with reliability in the muddy trenches, but Snipers being craftsmen seemed to have avoided that issue.

The swasey sight was bulky and did not allow much "eye relief" the result was the often painful "scoping" of snipers whereby the recoil belts the telescopic sight back into the eye socket or bridge of nose which results in pain for the shooter but much hilarity from peers !

sorry cant find much stuff on French equipment

[Landsturm]

I have read that 03s and a few P17s were used with a Winchester A5 scope or, less frequently, the squat M1908/13 Warner & Swasey model; but some snipers preferred open sights.

As for Ross... according to some sources, Ross is one of the worst and unrealible (is that spelled right ?) service rifles ever. But yes, snipers did use them since they were accurate.

[Guest R Pope]

The problem with the Ross was not reliability, if properly maintained it was and is a good weapon. The danger comes from faulty reassembly after cleaning. The bolt can be installed with one too few turns on the end piece, thus allowing it to be fired with the bolt not locked. It's a straight-pull action, so the firer may not notice he's in danger until the bolt flies back into his head on firing, at which point it's too late!

[Landsturm]

Ouch!

[Malcolm]

There is a picture of 2nd Lt Oliver DLI, sniper, with a.303 Ross sporting rifle.

It does not appear to have a telescopic sight.

Aye

Malcolm

[simon2]

Malcolm,

Where is this picture of 2nd Lt Oliver you talk about.

Is it accessible on the web as I would like to see it as I am planning on building a model of a WW1 sniper.

Regards,

Simon.

[bkristof]

As far as i know the French used Lebel rifles.

There is somewhere a picture of a French soldier with a sniper Lebel, there is a tube shaped scope mounted.

[P.B.]

The Ross rifle held by 2/Lt Wifred Oliver was a sporting model presented to 2/DLI by the Marquis of Londonderry (a prominant Durham coal-owner). The rifle itself is currently on display at the DLI Museum -I'll take a photo to post next time I'm in there.

In the meantime, I've attached a coloured version of this famous photo of Oliver, taken near Houplines in 1915, which appeared in Mollo and Turner's "Army Uniforms of World War 1":

All the best

Paul.