South East Africa

[Kerin]

Hi, I am after some help identfying or narrowing down the regiment/unit of my Great- grandfather.  I have no idea where in the world he came from but he settled in South Africa around the time of the Boer war, then served in WW1 and is said to have died of Spanish flu at the end of the war. His kids were in an orphanage in South Africa their mother having died before the war. 

The notes with the photo say East Africa 1914, which is hopefully correct. It is certainly Africa. 

I assumed it was a South African military uniform but someone pointed out it is very similar to the Canadian and American uniforms. I think it is cavalry, he does have spurs on. Any ideas anyone?

[Waddell]

Kerin,

 

A name would be very useful as well.

 

Scott

Edited 23 February , 2019 by Waddell
Added more.

[FROGSMILE]

That type of hat, generally known as a ‘campaign hat’, or ‘lemon squeezer’ was quite common as an alternative to the Terai or slouch hat, for wear in South Africa.  It was especially common for light horse and mounted rifles units from various Dominions or Colonies and became quite iconic, although perhaps less so than what became associated in public consciousness with the Australian style, i.e. one side turned up. It was even brought back to Britain by Baden Powell, who had been introduced to it by American scout and woodsman, Frederick Russell Burnham (see figure with sword below), and adopted by the Boy Scout Movement as their first uniform headdress.

 

Unfortunately the uniform is too generic to ID a unit, although if pushed I would suggest the Legion of Frontiersmen as a possibility.  See:  http://www.frontiersmenhistorian.info/myth.htm  Interestingly, wearing a collar and tie, or neckerchief, with the trailing end tucked in the front of the shirt seems to have been a common style adopted by some irregular units in the 2nd Anglo/Boer War.

 

Edited 25 February , 2019 by FROGSMILE

[Waddell]

Frogsmile,

 

Agree that the uniform is very generic.

 

Is the belt of any use in identifying him? It looks like a Slade Wallace type belt.

 

Again, his name would be useful if he served in WW1. A unit like East African Mounted rifles is another possibility.

 

Scott

[KONDOA]

Certainly EAMR wore that style amongst others.

 

Roop

[FROGSMILE]

On 23/02/2019 at 02:11, Waddell said:

Frogsmile,

 

Agree that the uniform is very generic.

 

Is the belt of any use in identifying him? It looks like a Slade Wallace type belt.

 

Again, his name would be useful if he served in WW1. A unit like East African Mounted rifles is another possibility.

 

Scott

 

Unfortunately the Slade Wallace equipment belt (which I agree that it is) predominantly had a general service buckle, although some Colonial versions had a plain crown centre with a blank circlet.  Either way they are no use for identifying a unit.

 

IWM Photos of East African Mounted Rifles principally show them wearing either Wolseley helmets or Terai (slouch hats), so I don’t think it’s them.

 

Edited 24 February , 2019 by FROGSMILE

[Kerin]

Thanks for some useful ideas. His name was George Anderson, although the photo may be his son Leslie Anderson. George would have been about 40 while Leslie would have been about 18. He looks young to me, but the photo is labled George.  They both died of Spanish Flu at the end of the war. My father was named John Leslie in memory of his uncle Leslie Anderson.

Edited 25 February , 2019 by Kerin
Added more details

[MaureenE]

You could write to the relevant archive in South Africa to see whether there is a service record

Cheers

Maureen

[FROGSMILE]

3 hours ago, Kerin said:

Thanks for some useful ideas. His name was George Anderson, although the photo may be his son Leslie Anderson. George would have been about 40 while Leslie would have been about 18. He looks young to me, but the photo is labled George.  They both died of Spanish Flu at the end of the war. My father was named John Leslie in memory of his uncle Leslie Anderson.

 

The connection with East Africa suggests the 25th (Frontiersmen) Battalion, Royal Fusiliers.  See the following from their history website:

 

"For details of the campaign of the 25th Bn. Royal Fusiliers (Frontiersmen) in East Africa please consult chapter five of One Hundred Years of The Legion of Frontiersmen by Geoffrey A. Pocock.

 

The British Army has always had the reputation for putting square pegs into round holes, but in the First War, as Capt. Cherry Kearton said "There was certainly one unit, however, in which experts were employed in their proper place, and that was the 25th Bn. Royal Fusiliers...the credit for that belongs less to the War Office than to Colonel Daniel Patrick Driscoll." His ideas of the men he wanted in the 25th Bn. Royal Fusiliers (Frontiersmen), were based on his Frontiersmen. He wanted a mixture of the Irregular Scout guerrillas of the Boer War and Commandos 30 years ahead of time. It is interesting that in East Africa they were often known as the Frontiersmen and “The Times” History of the War referred to them as the Legion of Frontiersmen. New Zealander Frontiersman Pedersen said that "The age limit was 25-48 years; but it was obvious that a few old-timers must have forgotten the year in which they were born..."  Driscoll succeeded in getting a commission for the famous hunter F.C. Selous for his knowledge of the area, in spite of his 64 years. Other African hunters recruited by him were Martin Ryan, George Outram and Jock Richardson. 25th were the only Battalion of the B.E.F. to embark and enter the field without training.

 

Men who had joined other units were desperate to move to the 25th and a number even deserted to do so. When their train was leaving Waterloo, the R.S.M. went down it to warn that the Police were coming to search for deserters. A surprising number of men climbed out the other side of the train and hid until the Police had passed. They sailed on the "Neuralia" for Mombasa, arrived on 6th May, 1915, and were quickly in action.

The first major battle to involve the Frontiersmen was Bukoba in June. The main action involved the 25th and the Loyal North Lancs. After a fierce battle the enemy was cleared from the town, and the Frontiersmen captured the German flag which they still hold. In August at Maktau Lt. Wilbur Dartnell, an Australian, was awarded a posthumous V.C.

 

In that unhealthy climate, troops suffered badly from malaria and in January 1916 reinforcements arrived. After a long march chasing the Germans as part of General Stewart's column the 25th arrived at Moschi. They were constantly in action through the Handeni area to Kwa Direma on the Lukigura. There two companies under Major White stormed an enemy position with fixed bayonets showing great bravery.

They then moved south to Makindu where they rested for a while, as numbers of fit men had dwindled from nearly 1200 to less than 200. The 25th then marched south to Kissaki. The morale of the 25th soared when their great hero Capt. Selous marched into camp with reinforcements. Although 65 and having returned to England for surgery, he had insisted on returning. The 25th moved towards Behobeho and then Selous was killed leading his company in action. The Frontiersmen fought like tigers to avenge him, not least his servant and friend Ramazani.. Behobeho and the banks of the Rufugi were occupied and the Frontiersmen were sent to the Cape for three months rest. This is one of the lesser-known and seldom seen accounts of the death of Selous taken from an unknown cutting by an unidentified writer “Flying in East Africa”.

 

In May 1917, the battalion left for Lindi. Fierce fighting at Ziwani and Tandamuti were followed in August by the battle at Narunyu. There the Frontiersmen showed their ability to use any style of fighting as, being attacked from all sides, they successfully formed a hollow square, as in the Victorian army, and defended themselves for five days until ordered to retire under darkness.

Before the end of the year the handful of the men of the 25th still left found their unit disbanded and the men returned home with great honour.

The following Battle Honours were awarded to the Royal Fusiliers in recognition of the active service of the 25th battalion in East Africa:

“Kilimanjaro”
“Behobeho”
“Nyangao”
“East Africa 1915-17”

 

Although it has often been mistakenly claimed that the Battle Honours were awarded to the Frontiersmen, this could not be so, as Battle Honours are never awarded to individual battalions but to a Regiment as a whole.

We are regularly consulted by descendants of men who served with the 25th Bn. Royal Fusiliers in East Africa. They are researching the following men: Capt. G. Outram: Francis J. Schenkel: George Sample: Charles Beechey: F.W. Mills: Harry Bird: Frederick S. Flynn: C.Q.M.S. Walters: Charles E. Bryant: Capt. W.R. Richards: C.Q.M.S. J.A. Richards: Walter Richards: Sgt. W.G. Skeet: Thomas Weightman: L/Cpl Allan Harden.

 

If you are researching any other men who served with this Battalion, please e-mail the webmaster and we will be pleased to publish brief details of your interest and/or put you into contact with others". See: http://www.frontiersmenhistorian.info/fusiliers.htm

Edited 25 February , 2019 by FROGSMILE

[SteveE]

On ‎23‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 09:06, FROGSMILE said:

IWM Photos of East African Mounted Rifles principally show them wearing either Wolseley helmets or Terai (slouch hats), so I don’t think it’s them.

Assuming the "East Africa 1914" is accurate then that rather limits the number of mounted units that it is likely to be as the South Africans didn't arrive until later in the war.

 

He could possibly be Legion of Frontiersmen as, although they didn't fight as that unit, they did so as a squadron of the East African Mounted Rifles whilst another possibility is that he was a member of Bowker's Horse although they too were eventually subsumed into the East African Mounted Rifles.  However, having said that I cannot find a suitable candidate in the medal Rolls etc.

 

Steve

[Waddell]

Kerin,

 

Maureene's suggestion looks like the right way to progress your research. I suspect a common surname and forename are not working in your favour though.

 

Working backwards a bit, if the father (George Anderson) came to settle in South Africa around the time of the Boer War and he was aged 40 years in 1914, it is possible that he served in that conflict and stayed on. A name search of George Anderson here gives seven pages of them who served in the Boer War, including Canadians.

 

https://www.angloboerwar.com/name-search

 

I'm not sure if that helps but a lot of soldiers stayed in that part of the world after the Boer War. Their death certificates may provide more details.

 

Scott

[Annette Carson]

Arriving a little late to this discussion, but it might help if I offer confirmation that the photograph almost certainly IS East (not South) Africa. I recognized the vegetation and asked a friend to consult Dr Charles Botha, Professor of Biology at the University of KwaZulu Natal, who says: It looks very much as if German East Africa is the probable location of your great-grandfather, although it's not possible to venture an exact location.

Hope this is helpful

Best wishes

Annette

[SteveE]

14 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said:

The connection with East Africa suggests the 25th (Frontiersmen) Battalion, Royal Fusiliers

Assuming that the "East Africa 1914" note is again accurate and the fact that the 25th Battalion Royal Fusiliers (Frontiersmen) weren't formed until February 1915 and didn't arrive in East Africa until May of that same year then I personally wouldn't place too much weight on that suggestion being likely.  If he was Legion of Frontiersmen then the local East African unit which formed a squadron of the East African Mounted Rifles would, in my opinion, be the more likely but I can find no evidence that supports that particular suggestion.

 

Steve

 

[FROGSMILE]

17 minutes ago, SteveE said:

Assuming that the "East Africa 1914" note is again accurate and the fact that the 25th Battalion Royal Fusiliers (Frontiersmen) weren't formed until February 1915 and didn't arrive in East Africa until May of that same year then I personally wouldn't place too much weight on that suggestion being likely.  If he was Legion of Frontiersmen then the local East African unit which formed a squadron of the East African Mounted Rifles would, in my opinion, be the more likely but I can find no evidence that supports that particular suggestion.

 

Steve

 

 

I agree that an East African local unit connection is probably the most likely from both apparent date and circumstance.  It's really just the dress, especially the hat that suggests to me a possible Frontiersmen connection.

Edited 25 February , 2019 by FROGSMILE

[Kerin]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone. All clues are very welcome. I know so little about my grandmothers family. She was born in Oct 1901 in Port Elizabeth, South Africa but I don't know the dates or locations of her parents or siblings birth, death or marriage.  The WW1 service of her father and brother and death due to Spanish flu is one of the few things that have been passed down along with a few photos. These are George and his wife Fanny supposedly in 1889, he looks to be at least 21 which would make him 46 in 1914. The chap in East Africa looks younger than 46 to me.  Alternatively the soldier in East Africa is his son Leslie, the young man in the photo dated 1915. Would he really have come back from East Africa to have such a smart looking photo taken or would it have be taken before he left? He might be aged 17-25. In which case I suspect he only arrived in East Africa in 1915 or later and possibly came with a South African force, his sister was living in an orphanage in Port Elizabeth at the time. 

 

[FROGSMILE]

I’m sorry to say it, but I don’t think that the facial features in the original photo look anything like either of these latter men.

Edited 26 February , 2019 by FROGSMILE

[Kerin]

I've just tried them both on a facial recognition app which gave a Very high probability that the soldier is Leslie, but a Normal probability that it is George. 

[FROGSMILE]

53 minutes ago, Kerin said:

I've just tried them both on a facial recognition app which gave a Very high probability that the soldier is Leslie, but a Normal probability that it is George. 

 

Interesting, I hope that you can learn more to corroborate who, what and when so that you can get to the bottom of things.

Edited 26 February , 2019 by FROGSMILE

[Kerin]

I have found a possible match for Leslie Anderson twice in the WW1 Medal Rolls Card index.

The name is L R Anderson, Corps South Afrcian S Corts (MT), No 964 DVR. 

Operations DCM LG 13.2.1917 Vol and Page B70-13

I am not a militry historian and am struggling with some of the acronyms. Could (MT) mean mounted? What are S Corts and DCM? Could it be Service Corps?

 

Then there is another card for :

Anderson No 984 Dvr L R (could Dvr be driver? or is it a rank?, the writing is not clear so it might not be Dvr.

South African Army Service Corps

M.?. D.   ?? 8-2-17     Paye?? 1356

The writing is not very clear and I can't intepret the last line apart from the date.

 

I am guessing these are the same man and that someone has mis-read No 984 for 964 at some stage. Does that seem reasonable?

 

So before I get too excited that I may have tracked Leslie down can I ask if the photograph in uniform could reasonably be someone in the South African Army Service Corps? I am assuming the photo must have been taken 1915-1917 as the South Africans only got there in 1915.

 

Links to the cards are below and a couple of photos. Let me know if I should not put the photos up here and I can delete them.  

 

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/1262/30850_A001817-00393?pid=3090068&treeid=&personid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=6hu-1277486&_phstart=successSource

 

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/1262/30850_A001820-01106?pid=165135&treeid=&personid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=6hu658864&_phstart=successSource

[Waddell]

Kerin,

 

It is South African Army Service Corps and M.T is for Motorised Transport.

 

DVR is Driver.

 

This explains it for the British Army-

 

https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-army-service-corps-in-the-first-world-war/army-service-corps-mechanical-transport-companies/

 

I don't think that uniform is right for your man serving in the ASC in 1917. I think that image is earlier (as you suggest 1914, or possibly earlier as has also been suggested).

 

Here are some images from the internet of the type of uniform I would expect to have been worn at the time. Note: most images of South African and British troops in the field at that time seem to show shorts and puttees being worn to cope with the conditions. The sun helmet was in common use as well.

 

The five ASC men in the lower image are from a British unit, however I would expect the uniforms to be similar. They are dressed for a studio photograph, not the field.

 

It would be worth tracking down his service records to see if they hold any further clues as to his next of kin and previous service details.

 

Glad to see you are progressing with your research.

 

Scott

 

 

Edited 4 March , 2019 by Waddell
Added more.

[FROGSMILE]

DCM = Distinguished Conduct Medal (announced in the) LG = London Gazette. 13th February 1917.

 

MID = Mention in Dispatches. LG 8th February 1917.

 

Clearly he was a brave man in the conduct of operations in Feb 1917.

 

The London Gazette is searchable online, so with these details you should be able to find the citations.

Edited 4 March , 2019 by FROGSMILE