Davidscanlan Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 Hi Back in October I visited the battlefields on the Western front when we were at Newfoundland Park my daughter came across this shell casing and I’m wondering if anyone could identify it for me. Is it allied or axis forces shell can anybody give me an idea of the weight can anyone identify it for me. Many thanks dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ServiceRumDiluted Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 (edited) German 77mm, probably shrapnel. The giveaway are the ribs at the bottom to seat the projectile in the cartridge case. The copper driveband is missing, these were scavanged during and after the war for their scrap value. Missing the top section and fuze which would have been blown off when the shell functioned. Edited 24 December , 2018 by ServiceRumDiluted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davidscanlan Posted 24 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 24 December , 2018 Many thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davidscanlan Posted 24 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 24 December , 2018 I’ve also got a fuse and a grenade which was purchased over there and also found a decayed bullet too at Newfoundland park. Would you be able to identify these ? 17 minutes ago, ServiceRumDiluted said: German 77mm, probably shrapnel. The giveaway are the ribs at the bottom to seat the projectile in the cartridge case. The copper driveband is missing, these were scavanged during and after the war for their scrap value. Missing the top section and fuze which would have been blown off when the shell functioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ServiceRumDiluted Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 I'll give them a go, someone here will be able to I'm sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 I assume the fuse and grenade are not live? Potentially very dangerous otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davidscanlan Posted 24 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 24 December , 2018 15 minutes ago, mancpal said: I assume the fuse and grenade are not live? Potentially very dangerous otherwise. No they’re spent 41 minutes ago, ServiceRumDiluted said: I'll give them a go, someone here will be able to I'm sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools mckenna Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 56 minutes ago, Davidscanlan said: No they’re spent Its a fuse from an artillery shell, not a grenade (maybe german,someone else who knows more about fuses can tell you more) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay dubaya Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 British No 85 timed fuze, I’d agree with SRD on the German 77mm round and please someone tell me that’s not cordite hanging out of the .303? round Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depaor01 Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 17 minutes ago, jay dubaya said: British No 85 timed fuze, I’d agree with SRD on the German 77mm round and please someone tell me that’s not cordite hanging out of the .303? round That's 100% certainly cordite. Unless it's been filled with dried spaghetti for effect... Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davidscanlan Posted 24 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 24 December , 2018 1 hour ago, Jools mckenna said: Its a fuse from an artillery shell, not a grenade (maybe german,someone else who knows more about fuses can tell you more) Yeah I know that here’s the grenade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davidscanlan Posted 24 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 24 December , 2018 38 minutes ago, jay dubaya said: British No 85 timed fuze, I’d agree with SRD on the German 77mm round and please someone tell me that’s not cordite hanging out of the .303? round I know cordite replaced gunpowder but is it dangerous considering it’s age etc ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ServiceRumDiluted Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 I'm not sure from the photo if that grenade is a no23 or a no5, variants of the British Mills, though it's a moot point unless you are being very precise as both are pukka WW1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 Could be either. There were some subtle differences to the shoulders but post January 1917 they were all 23 mk IIs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 25 December , 2018 Share Posted 25 December , 2018 Some years ago I picked up a similar bullet on the Somme complete with exposed cordite . The colleague I met over there had brought his son along and during the journey from the airport I mentioned that I’d no idea what sort of bullet it was. My mate passed it to his son who instantly said “ its. a .303”. He then pulled a strand of cordite out and promptly picked up his lighter and lit it ! I nearly exited through the roof of my van. I asked him how he knew about munitions and it turned out he had just returned from his second tour of Afghanistan where he had spent the previous months diffusing road side bombs, I don’t suppose a sliver of cordite instilled much fear in him . The only way I can describe the cordite burning was like a kids sparkler, it’s obviously a different beast when completely enclosed. Out of curiosity how can you tell if a shell fuse is live or not? Ive seen a good few and to my mind they all look the same (probably a good reason not to start collecting them). Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 26 December , 2018 Share Posted 26 December , 2018 Please see the note on the opening page of Arms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 26 December , 2018 Share Posted 26 December , 2018 Apologies if my post breaks the rules, it was not my intention. I don’t visit the Arms section as it’s definitely not within my sphere of interest but have followed your advice. simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Clifton Posted 26 December , 2018 Share Posted 26 December , 2018 21 hours ago, mancpal said: The only way I can describe the cordite burning was like a kids sparkler, it’s obviously a different beast when completely enclosed. I once visited Varlet Farm when Charlotte was in charge of it. She gave us a demonstration of a small piece of cordite burning in the open air. It's all about the gas produced by the ignition being able to expand freely, which it can't inside a closed cartridge. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 26 December , 2018 Share Posted 26 December , 2018 Presumably why my mates son (still serving) frightened the life out of me by lighting it, at that point I had known him for 20mins or so and had no idea he was a soldier let alone involved in bomb disposal. You live and learn. Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikB Posted 27 December , 2018 Share Posted 27 December , 2018 On 24/12/2018 at 14:24, depaor01 said: That's 100% certainly cordite. Unless it's been filled with dried spaghetti for effect... Dave Agreed. But it's discoloured and bleached, so its chemical condition is probably unknowable. Yes, it does burn tamely in the open air, but the burning rate increases enormously with pressure and temperature, which is why it generates about 20-odd tons per square inch in a rifle barrel, and licks the rifling (rather briefly :-D) with a flame the surface temperature of the sun. If the cordite's still there, it's also likely the chlorate primer's still live, so don't torch the cordite if you mind a bit of a bang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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