William Turner Royal Fusiliers D. 11.10.1918

[Mon49]

I have been researching the men whose names appear on the War Memorial in our town of Hatherleigh in Devon but have been unable to find anything regarding the name of William Turner apart from the very limited details in the records held in Exeter in the Memorial Book stating the date of his death, 11th October 1918 (France/Europe) and his regiment Royal Fusiliers. I have followed the trail of a William Turner born in Hatherleigh (registered Okehampton) in 1895, son of Richard and Frances Alice Turner, he appears in the 1911 Census at Higher Barracks, Exeter, with the 3rd Devonshire Regiment, he is discharged later after claiming pay as a volunteer as well as being in the Devonshires. I believe he then signed on to the 2nd Battalion Lancashire Fusiliers and went AWOL, again he was discharged for falsifying his assetation forms and because of his conduct "not likely to be an efficient soldier" . After this I can find no leads to place this William Turner as joining up with another regiment and going to France, the trail goes cold.

 

I have tried all the usual sites for records of a William Turner killed on this date and in the Royal Fusiliers to no avail, any help or advice that members can give me of where to look next would be gratefully received.

 

Thank you.

 

 

 

[ss002d6252]

 I can't see anything in the effects records under that name - there is the possibility he used an alias but I can't see anything obvious at the moment.

Craig

[ss002d6252]

There is a man who enlisted in the RGA as #41102 on 21 May 14 who seems to be the same man was the one you have found - William Turner, age 19yrs 310days of Hatherleigh. https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM/WO363-4/007273869/00509&parentid=GBM/WO363-4/7273869/49/509

 

He was discharged on 22 July 14 for having failed to mention his discharge from 2nd Lancashire Fusiliers. It looks like he was in prison until 15 Aug 14 due to a conviction for false enlistment.

 

Craig

Edited 29 October , 2018 by ss002d6252

[JulianR]

There is a William Turner died 8th Oct, 1918 of Royal Fusiliers Regt No. G/100302, 

[ss002d6252]

19 minutes ago, JulianR said:

There is a William Turner died 8th Oct, 1918 of Royal Fusiliers Regt No. G/100302, 

His monies were issued to his widow, Ellen. That man stated he was born in Pontypridd .

 

Craig

[Mark1959]

The man died 8/10/1918 was previously 9520 Wilts and according to SDGW enlisted Devonport. Based on latter may need further investigation to exclude for certain.

[ss002d6252]

#100302 Turner was paid a war gratuity of £18 10s

https://wargratuity.uk/war-gratuity-calculator/

 

Craig

[Mon49]

On 29/10/2018 at 17:22, ss002d6252 said:

There is a man who enlisted in the RGA as #41102 on 21 May 14 who seems to be the same man was the one you have found - William Turner, age 19yrs 310days of Hatherleigh. https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM/WO363-4/007273869/00509&parentid=GBM/WO363-4/7273869/49/509

 

He was discharged on 22 July 14 for having failed to mention his discharge from 2nd Lancashire Fusiliers. It looks like he was in prison until 15 Aug 14 due to a conviction for false enlistment.

 

Craig

Yes this is the same man, thank you for looking.

[Mon49]

On 29/10/2018 at 17:56, JulianR said:

There is a William Turner died 8th Oct, 1918 of Royal Fusiliers Regt No. G/100302, 

William`s mother was born in Wales and I am sure I found at one time he had used an address Egypt Street, Pontypridd and given his same family members names on the form. I will follow this line up . Many thanks.

Monica

[Guest]

Thankyou  this post has helped me solve a mystery  Which William Turner was it that had married  my Gt Grandmother Ellen Ella Cunningham on 1 Dec 1916 he gave right and wrong info  on his marriage registration Correct was his fathers name was Richard incorrect he had put  his father down as deceased and his former employment was that of a Quartermaster Sargent   Nope not even  close Richard was mostly an agricultural;labourer in most censuses..  Seems he was caught out telling a few fibs on forms,  once you separate truth from some his untruths it all starts to make sense and about some  of his numerous service numbers he  got over the time.. I pick up William's  war record in Sept 2015  he was transferred on the 27-30 Sept 1915 • 19th general hospital, Alexandria, Egypt and was treated for Neurasthenia  while serving with the 8th Welsh Pioneers regiment  number 27143 ..30th September he was transferred to no 6 convalescent home to recover as of September 1915 was listed as having two years in service & 3 months with his present regiment..
Fast Forward 1 Dec 1016 marriage To Ellen   he is again listed as  8th Welsh Pioneers regiment  number 27143 his old  habit changing some details on documents still occurring (It was this through me off track so long  Richard i was searching for only existed in Williams imagination vivid as it was lol..  You than fast forward to 8th Oct 1918  William's death records  has a  least one error shows he was born in Pontypridd it was really Hatherleigh, Devonshire perhaps that was a leftover reminder of William's desire to change the facts.. Something we will never know.. Once I looked into some his lies actually found some obvious answers.. Thanks  for this the part about being caught out with inaccurate info on enlistment documents made this very easy to solve, Oh and my Gt Grandmother named 5 of her children  after william and his siblings 3 of those names are rather uncommon names  proofs in the pudding as to say
Death 8th Oct 1918

Burial 8th Oct 1918 • Rocquigny Road British Cemetery, Manancourt, Somme, France

 

[ss002d6252]

Quote

and his former employment was that of a Quartermaster Sargent   Nope not even  close Richard was mostly an agricultural;labourer in most censuses..

It may be possible that his father had been a QM Sgt in a volunteer battalion - that wouldn't be shown on the census.

Craig

[Mon49]

I haven`t checked this site for some time and I am so pleased that at long last the mystery of William Turner looks to have been cleared up, I thought he was going to be Hatherleigh`s "Unknown Soldier"! All that Bert has said fits with some of the old notes that I dug out from a few years ago, there were some partial letters sent to Commanding Officers asking for remuniation for loss of payment for lodging and money lent.

The first letter talks about a railway warrant issued to Pte W Turner no.10955 and that he was an absconder and that it was also the 2nd warrant issued under false pretences. Sheerness to Brecon.Command 1st-3rd S W Boarderers.3.5.1913

On the 21.5.1913 a letter from a Matthew Richards in Pontypridd to say that he was owed a fortnights board and was a big loss to him. He was himself an old soldier from the Welsh Reg.

Next letter was dated 10.8.1913 Woolwich: On the evening of the 4th inst. Pte Turner no 10955 of 1st Batt. S W Borderers was brought to my house by an outside porter from Royal Arsenal Station. He stated he was on furlough from Chatham and required board and lodging, I accomodated him. He related afterwards that his Col Sergeant was sending his box and his money here. At midday on Friday last he went out obstensibly to meet the CS with his box, I have not seen him since.A friend I consulted said that he suspected that Turner was probably an absentee and that the police would have his name in the Gazette, this turned out to be the case, in fact he was known to have absconded since April. I lent him money and he owes for board and lodging all together 18/-, I am a lone woman and can ill afford to lose it, I would be obliged if you can help me get my money. M. Rich  The reply was: Madam, In reply to your letter received on the 12th inst I regret that I am unable to assist you to recover the amount due to you, as Private Turner is a deserter and has no pay due to him. 14.8.1913 The follow up to this was a telegram Chatham 4.9.1913 Pte Turner 10955 Apprehended as deserter, appears Dartford Court this morning with escort.

William`s father Richard born in Meeth, the village next to Hatherleigh, was an agricultural worker all his life but he might be the Sgt Turner of the Volunteers Rifle Shooting team in Hatherleigh, he died in 1918 and his 3rd wife Frances Alice (William`s mother) nee Martin born in Swansea moved to Plymouth with daughter D.1946.

Edited 19 February , 2020 by Mon49
copied twice