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Remembered Today:

Name removed from war memorial ?


jim_davies

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Wondered if anyone has come across names being removed from war memorials. I was recently sent a photograph of the plaque on the wall of All Saint's Church, Stamford, Lincs, which clearly showed a deletion. Checked with the person who sent it to me, and it wasn't a photographical blemish, and has apparently been the situation since at least the 1940s (and probably before).

So why would someone's name have been removed. I've considered a few possibilities, but none really fit.

Any ideas ?

Jim

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There could be many reasons although I would think the practice is uncommon.

Without knowing the circumstances...

The name could be duplicated with another on the same memorial (names are often repeated on different village/town memorials due to multiple associations - not unusual). The person could not have died! (There are examples of living people on war memorials) or it may have turned out that the death was not due to the war.

Or a mistake by the plaque maker!

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I've heard several instances of soldiers being named on multiple war memorials so although that is a possible answer I am not sure that alone would cause a man's name to be erased.

I've also heard of the "missing" coming back to their home village years later. It is hard believe to that families wouldnt have deaths confirmed by the WO but apparently some men stayed in Belgium or Italy or wherever it may have been and just didnt bother getting in touch with their families until they literally turned up on the door-step years later. I cant give any examples but I have definitely read of this although I wouldnt have thought it was a common occurence and I dont know how the men would have got through the demob. I am just wondering if it was more likely that a POW could get lost in the system, and perhaps decide to stay on the farm he had been working in southern Bavaria with Frau ...

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Hi guys,

Thanks for the ideas.

I'm pretty sure that its not a matter of being duplicated on other war memorials. Stamford has it's own main town memorial as well as multiple parish church memorials, so I would imagine there are a number of duplications.

I was thinking along the lines of a lad being reported as missing/killed and then resurfacing later on, however I wasn't sure if this actually happened.

Signals, if you come across the references to this happening I would love to hear the details.

What makes it more interesting, on closer inspection of the photo, it that it appears that it may be a memorial that shows both the fallen and those that served.

Something to look into later on in the year when I get home.

Thanks,

Jim

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Jim

I'm pretty sure that I've seen a reference to a man listed on Brighouse War memorial returning alive and well. I'll look it up next time I'm in the local library and get back to you.

Regards

Rob

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Jim

I've visited the local library. There is a reference to a missing man who was named on the Brighouse Memorial and who returned but it doesn't say whether his name was subsequently deleted.

Interestingly another source names a corporal Eastwood as being named on a list found in Brighouse library of those commemorated but his name isn't on the memorial. Possibly this is the man.

Rob

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I have come across a similar thing for WW2 where a man came home after being a POW to find his name on the town memorial. He had been reported Missing KIA in the local press.

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On a similar vein, I have come across a possible hoax name on a war memorial.... On the Doddington (Kent) memorial there is an .. A Midget. I can find no trace of this man anywhere ! Also on the Sittingbourne memorial (kent) the same chap appears twice as Irvin and again as Ervin.. perhaps the same thing has happened on the memorial mentioned.

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Guest Ian Bowbrick

This is not uncommon at the Runnymede Memorial to RAF Aircrew Reported as Missing in action. A number of Battle of Britain aircrew have been located through aircraft excavations and their remains buried and names removed from the Memorial. Nearly all are buried at Brookwood: there is a small row of 4 graves on the front left of the RAF plot containing P/O Colin Francis, P/O Basil Ramsay, F/Sgt Hugh Ellis and one other whose name escapes me and two others top right Sgt John Brimble and F/Lt Hugh Beresford.

Ian

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Having 'done' a few memorials I've come to the conclusion that they are not the most reliable of sources. Spelling mistakes (sometimes quite bizarre e.g. a Herbert Wilkinson named as Henry Wilkinson) and people apparantly missed off are quite common, as are the same name appearing on several different memorials. Mind you, I've never seen a deletion.

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Ian

The mention of Sgt John Brimble above reminds me of an odd fact....

He is the only man with two genuine official war graves. The story goes like this.

BRIMBLE, John Joseph

Sergeant (Pilot) 741563

73 Sqn, Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve

Died 14.09.40 when his Hurricane crashed at Chart Sutton, Kent Age 23

Son of William Henry & Emily Annie Brimble of Knowle, Bristol

Partial remains of this casualty were recovered on two separate occasions. Those recovered first in 1940 were buried as an unidentified airman in Sittingbourne & Milton (Sittingbourne) Cemetery, Kent. The second set recovered in 1980 were buried in a named grave in Brookwood Military Cemetery, Surrey. In 1998 the error was discovered but the two graves have been left undisturbed at the request of the next-of-kin. Therefore, this airman has two graves each now with a named memorial.

Sittingbourne Grave: Old Ground W.49

Sorry - Way off topic!

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While we are off topic!!

If my fading memory serves me right I seem to remember a rumpus over a possible deletion on the Worthing (West Sussex) war memorial a few years ago. I didn't get to follow the story through as I was working full time (50 hour weeks the kind of things we do to make ends meet).

If anybody knows anything about this one please let me know

Regards

Ali

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Guest Ian Bowbrick

Terry,

I remember the rumpus when Steve Vizard exhumed John Brimble's remains in 1980. It was after then that the MOD put restrictions on aircraft archeology and you needed a licence. Steve actually recovered John Brimble's cheque book from the site and at one time it was on display at Hendon. I have a photograph of John Brimble and will post it if you are interested.

Closer to home to me at the time was when Sgt Ernest Scott of 222 Sqd was recovered from Hollingbourne. The MOD had a bit of a red face about that one on two counts. First of all they had told Andy Saunders it was the site of a crashed Hurricane (wrong it was a Spitfire) and there were no human remains on the site (wrong again). Also they had told the family that Sgt Scott had crashed into the Channel. His brother was less than impressed!

Apologies for deviating Pals.

Ian

:ph34r:

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You can have a pic of the Grave in Sittingbourne Cemetery if you want Terry... I walk my dog there every day!!!

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  • 2 weeks later...

I was asked about this missing name some time ago from this war memorial. All that I have been told is that he went missing and then turned up some years after the war and no one seems to have a name. The names on the memorial out side are not in alphabetical order which does not help. There is a bronze memorial inside the Church, so by doing a cross reverence with both memorials, ( that is if the bronze one was done first before the man turned up ? ) it may give up his name. There is a book in Stamford library called Stamford and the Great War 1914-1919, but it does not give any clues

cheers Keith

post-19-1056192952.jpg

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Keith,

Thanks for posting the picture-its a lot better than the one I have !

Apparently there is a difference of three names from the bronze plaque inside the church to this memorial.

Later in the year I'm hoping to spend some time in Stamford, and have a look at the Stamford Mercury's archives.

Jim

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