ALFRED JAMES CANDY- KILLED IN ACTION?? BBC NEWS ITEM

[Guest]

The Beeb has a feature on graiffiti of soldier's names scrawled by waiting soldiers during the Great War in a railway tunnel. This is not a new story-a similar story about the same graffiti appeared in 2007 and is still available online.  One concerns a man, Alfred James Candy-who appears to be named on the Llangollen war memorial. Slight problem is I cannot track any serviceman of the Great War  with that name. Does anyone have any idea who this man was and what the real story may be?

 

(I am just a tad suspicious- I have not far from me an example of graffiti-allegedly from the Great War-left on the wood strips used in lath plastering at Valentines, Ilford-but it just doesn't smell right to me. So this one seems a bit curious as well)

 

Story taken from BBC News website, with thanks

 

WW1 soldiers' farewell notes on Llangollen bridge being lost to damp

• 13 August 2018

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• World War One

 

Media captionRain and damp have erased the messages over the years

As he waited for the train to take him to the front, one soldier took a pencil and wrote of his hope of seeing his unborn baby.

But AJ Candy would never get his wish as he was killed in battle in World War One.

Now it is feared his farewell note and others written by soldiers on the bricks of a bridge in Llangollen, Denbighshire, could be lost forever.

There are concerns damp could erase them unless action is taken.

The signatures, scrawled on the bricks under the bridge close to Berwyn station, are thought to have been etched onto the wall as the soldiers waited to be taken to Flanders - but it is feared many have already been erased by algae and rain dripping through the railway.

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Image captionIwan Hughes stumbled across the marks when he was walking in Denbighshire

Iwan Hughes, a teacher from Flint, stumbled across the markings when he was exploring the area while on a holiday walk with a friend.

But it was not until they took a closer look that they realised the signatures' significance.

"We just stopped to have a look, being inquisitive, and we noticed the dates on some of them, and that some of them also had people with military ranks," he said.

"We realised what they were: they were in fact farewells if you like, soldiers saying farewell or writing things on the tiles, one of them even saying that he wished he could have this baby."

Image captionAlfred James Candy's name is on the Llangollen war memorial which pays tribute to those who died in World War One

Not a lot is known about the solider named Alfred James Candy, whose name is one of four written on the wall which matches those who died in battle listed on the town's war memorial.

"He must have walked along this path here to catch the train, just at the station up the road, and never returned," said Mr Hughes, who said he was making it his mission to find out more about the men behind the notes.

The Llangollen graffiti was last recorded in 2011 after being photographed.

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But over the years rain and damp have started to erase the names on the wall, which local historians believe were written in "trench pencil" - a pencil given to them as part of their kit - as they mulled going to war.

"The water and the algae has already obliterated the signatures of some of these men, like they themselves were obliterated on the fields of France and Belgium," said Mr Hughes, who wants to see the council or Cadw - the Welsh heritage body - take action to protect them from disappearing.

He believes they are of historical significance no matter what people's views on the war.

Image captionIt is thought the soldiers wrote the notes using "trench pencils" as they waited for their train to take them to the front Image captionThe notes are slowly being erased by damp and rain, but have not been touched by modern graffiti

Peter Jones, local historian and Llangollen Museum trustee, who has been trying to identify the soldiers, said the messages from the war needed to be protected.

"Some of the marks are "next stop Berlin" and various things like that, some of them left little messages," he said.

"It brings it home to you, it gives an insight into the private lives of the soldiers involved."

But he now fears it is "too late" to preserve them, adding: "I'd like to have it sort of covered in Perspex and put in a museum, but that's not going to happen."

Image captionThe dates on one of the notes are thought to show when they were written

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Edited 13 August , 2018 by Guest

[Nepper]

His name also features on the memorial plaque inside St Collen's church in Llangollen, see http://www.walesatwar.org/en/memorial/detail/1547

The only Alfred J Candy I can find is an RNVR Signalman service number B.Z/2369 and the only entry I've found for him is the medal roll recording his Victory & British War Medals.

[IPT]

Z/2369 was Alfred Joseph Candy, who was discharged in March 1919.

[Stebie9173]

The Clywd Family History Society site on Llangollen War Memorial lists him as:

 

Driver Alfred James Candy

No. 675653, "D" Bty. 285th Bde. Royal Field Artillery, KIA 17 Apr 1918, age 29, son of Albert and Rosina Candy, of 23, Maud St., Roath, nr. Cardiff. Nephew of Louisa Champion.  Buried at Le Grand Hasard Military Cemetery, Morbecque, Nord, France.

 

http://www.clwydfhs.org.uk/cofadeiladau/llangollen_wm.htm

 

 

Edit: Register of soldier's effects lists his effects going to his Aunt, Louisa Champion. It also lists him as James Candy and his unit as A/285th.

 

 

Steve.

Edited 13 August , 2018 by Stebie9173

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Stebie9173 said:

The Clywd Family History Society site on Llangollen War Memorial lists him as:

 

Driver Alfred James Candy

No. 675653, "D" Bty. 285th Bde. Royal Field Artillery, KIA 17 Apr 1918, age 29, son of Albert and Rosina Candy, of 23, Maud St., Roath, nr. Cardiff. Nephew of Louisa Champion.  Buried at Le Grand Hasard Military Cemetery, Morbecque, Nord, France.

 

http://www.clwydfhs.org.uk/cofadeiladau/llangollen_wm.htm

 

 

Edit: Register of soldier's effects lists his effects going to his Aunt, Louisa Champion. It also lists him as James Candy and his unit as A/285th.

 

 

Steve.

 

     Thanks Steve-   Yes, on CWGC as James Candy. How peculiar (though not unusual) that CWGC is amiss.  An e-mail note to them may go out.

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

This item was covered in a separate thread on this forum just a few days ago. Well done to Clwyd FHS and Llangollen Museum for bringing it to public attention.

 

(PS. GUEST, might you consider deleting the whole cut and paste from the BBC website, as the layout and formatting looks very odd on my tablet and smartphone, and perhaps replace with this handy link?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-45163110

[Guest]

On 14/08/2018 at 08:54, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said:

This item was covered in a separate thread on this forum just a few days ago. Well done to Clwyd FHS and Llangollen Museum for bringing it to public attention.

 

(PS. GUEST, might you consider deleting the whole cut and paste from the BBC website, as the layout and formatting looks very odd on my tablet and smartphone, and perhaps replace with this handy link?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-45163110

 

     If it is a duplicate, then my apologies- I zapped "Search" and nothing was coming up.  Alas, I do not have a tablet or a smartphone and, to be honest, am not that concerned that the layout on a smart phone might be awkward-  Too many websites have been rendered  hard to use by making them smartphone friendly- look at what CWGC has done.  So, the modern movement to appease the younger generation (rather than your good self) with accessibility that is quite a way down the IQ scale leaves me cold- We have just had details of the falling attendance figures at musems and art galleries in London-BM down by a million per annum- a spokesman has indicated that little darlings cannot really be expected to concentrate on something that is static and does not change within 15 seconds.

     As to links-1) Links disappear-cut and paste keeps the info here. 2) The last link I used was deleted by Mr. Roberts for reasons I know not.  (Better to have the info. than not) 

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

Berwyn Station Underpass

 

[Guest]

43 minutes ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said:

Berwyn Station Underpass

 

 

     DB- Are there any references to this graffiti that go back beyond 2007?????   There is a 2007 feature online about it but anything earlier??????  Just a little curious-if only because graffiti usually attracts more grafitti, so stuff from the Great War without the attentions of later additions or the taggers would be unusual.  Also, the lack of painting-over by British Rail et al.  

[ss002d6252]

 

     DB- Are there any references to this graffiti that go back beyond 2007?????   There is a 2007 feature online about it but anything earlier??????  Just a little curious-if only because graffiti usually attracts more grafitti, so stuff from the Great War without the attentions of later additions or the taggers would be unusual.  Also, the lack of painting-over by British Rail et al.  

Same thoughts I was having MIke.

 

Craig

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

This line and station were closed in the 60s , now a halt on the Llangollen Railway heritage steam line. 

 

It's a couple of miles out of Llangollen so never had big footfall, and only partly reopened in late 80s, so not an ideal candidate for graffiti.

 

Could be interesting to compare signatures with any attestation forms that may exist.

[Guest]

DB- I am not doubting it per se.  If there  are references I could find that were of any vintage, the matter would stop there-but 2007 seems the earliest. If the tunnel was not in public use for decades,then that would be good enough for "balance of probabilities". But I would have, blame History training, to question the provenance of this  heritage item.   Must have been too fixated  by the lovely Fiona Bruce and been too heavily influenced by "Fake or Fortune"......

    Can anyone from Clwyd vouch for it further back?????

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

It's a story new to me, so I can't help I'm afraid. Perhaps contact Clwyd FHS via the other thread?

[Trebrys]

Bore da / Good morning,

 

Thank you for all the interest, especially the probable identification of AJ Candy. I was the slightly balding one in the item covered by the Beeb!

 

Not that I'm suggesting that country youths are more angelic than their urban counterparts, but the location of the underpass doesn't really attract the graffiti-inclined louts, let alone create the urge to shake their aerosols there when the Muse inspires. The local youths would have far better things to do.  It is a few miles out of the town and hidden a little beyond the railway stop at Berwyn...way too far for any teen to be bothered to visit, unless dragged reluctantly by parents intent on educating them on the delights of a bracing walk in the countryside. It is so insignificant, the focus of any passer-by would be on the stop itself, which is immaculately kept, or on a safe crossing of the river via the really pretty chain bridge straddling the Dee. Having lived in the area for over fifty years I can vouch to its isolated location which would not draw attention to itself...a person's focus would be on everything else but that. 

 

You'd have to visit the place yourself to really see what I mean!

 

Some interest is being generated here in Wales now in the national (Welsh) Media...so who knows what'll happen next?

 

Cofion / Best wishes to all.

Edited 15 August , 2018 by Trebrys