Help Identifying German Imperial Navy Uniform/Badges

[Cherelle]

Hello. I'd like help confirming/identifying rank (if possible), and the medals/badges etc that my Great Uncle Willie Keller is wearing.

 

Unfortunately I don't know much about him, other than his name Willie Keller and the family was from Chemnitz. I do not know his date of birth or death, but my grandpa was born in 1886 and I believe Willie was his older brother.

 

I see he has a U-boat badge, and I believe the smaller badge shows two crossed swords? I'm wondering if it's possible to determine rank, other than he appears to be a low ranking officer... what is signified by the badges on his cap?

 

Ideally I would like to be able to find his military record. I'm hoping that record might list a date of birth or death.

 

[FROGSMILE]

The cap design and absence of shoulder straps or collar patches indicate that he is a junior commissioned officer of the Imperial German Navy,  unfortunately his cuffs are out of sight, as the cuff rings would indicate his precise rank.  The medal ribbon looks like it might be a Merit Cross with swords, although the practice of German States and Principalities each granting their own awards makes IDs very complicated.  His apparent age suggests that he may well have been commissioned from the lower decks (i.e. worked his way up). You might be able to trace him under the crews listed at link 5 below:

 

1.  https://goo.gl/images/nLdMXf

 

2.  

3.  http://www.reddickmilitaria.com/german-imperial-visor-caps/imperial-german-naval-officers-cap/

 

4.  http://www.theregaliaspecialist.com/Imperial_and_Third_Reich_SPECIAL_ITEMS/IMPERIAL_GERMAN__Special__Items/Imperial_German_Navy_WWI_U-Boat_submarine_Badge_ORIGINAL_QUALITY

 

5.  https://uboat.net/wwi/

 

6.  https://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/related/ribbons/ww1.htm

Edited 17 February , 2018 by FROGSMILE

[Cherelle]

Thank you so very much for those insights! It's too bad the cuffs are not visible in the photo. I will check out that crew list. 

[trajan]

This is all rather odd as that is surely a Weimar period stamp... And isn't that a 'Hindenburg' medal ribbon with crossed swords next to an EK - the 'Hindenburg' dating to 1933? Has Uncle Willy put on his old uniform for this photograph?

[FROGSMILE]

58 minutes ago, trajan said:

This is all rather odd as that is surely a Weimar period stamp... And isn't that a 'Hindenburg' medal ribbon with crossed swords next to an EK - the 'Hindenburg' dating to 1933? Has Uncle Willy put on his old uniform for this photograph?

 

I think that might well be the case.  I do not know what uniform was worn during the Weimar period, or for any vestigial caretakers of Naval equipment following the Versailles Treaty.

Edited 18 February , 2018 by FROGSMILE

[Cherelle]

Hmmm, the plot thickens.

 

I did blow up the medal ribbon, it almost appears to me to be a crown above crossed swords?

[Wexflyer]

9 hours ago, trajan said:

This is all rather odd as that is surely a Weimar period stamp... And isn't that a 'Hindenburg' medal ribbon with crossed swords next to an EK - the 'Hindenburg' dating to 1933? Has Uncle Willy put on his old uniform for this photograph?

Well spotted. But I thought the "Hindenburg Cross" was created in July 1934?

[Cherelle]

The 10pf Flugpost stamp on the back of the post card was created in 1919. So this is definitely post WW1, however, how long these stamps were in circulation is something I do not know. Weimar Stamp: http://sorenm.com/328-michel-no-111.html

Edited 18 February , 2018 by Cherelle

[FROGSMILE]

1 hour ago, Cherelle said:

Hmmm, the plot thickens.

 

I did blow up the medal ribbon, it almost appears to me to be a crown above crossed swords?

 

It appears to be one of these: https://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/related/ribbons/device_gallery/crown_and_swords/crown_and_swords1.htm

[trajan]

13 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

 

I think that might well be the case.  I do not know what uniform was worn during the Weimar period, or for any vestigial caretakers of Naval equipment following the Versailles Treaty.

 

Same here, but I doubt that it would have the crown on the hat!

 

4 hours ago, Wexflyer said:

Well spotted. But I thought the "Hindenburg Cross" was created in July 1934?

 

Ooops! Should have known that by heart by now

 

3 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

 

It appears to be one of these: https://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/related/ribbons/device_gallery/crown_and_swords/crown_and_swords1.htm

 

Indeed - a medal with combatants swords - but I had assumed these were for land warfare only...

Edited 19 February , 2018 by trajan

[The Prussian]

Hello!

IF he was an officer...

the naval ranklist of honour shows one Lt.z.S.  (Leutnant zur See = Naval Lieutenant) Willy Keller.

Born 26.5.1890

He served with submarines UB5, UB75 and UC23.

Later he was a judge at the field-court Friedrichsort.

The problem is, he was listed in Landwehrbezirk Wesel (VII. army corps, Rhine Province).

I don´t hink, he is it...

Edited 19 February , 2018 by The Prussian

[Cherelle]

20 minutes ago, The Prussian said:

Hello!

IF he was an officer...

the naval ranklist of honour shows one Lt.z.S.  (Leutnant zur See = Naval Lieutenant) Willy Keller.

Born 26.5.1890

He served with submarines UB5, UB75 and UC23.

Later he was a judge at the field-court Friedrichsort.

The problem is, he was listed in Landwehrbezirk Wesel (VII. army corps, Rhine Province).

I don´t hink, he is it...

 

That’s interesting ... the year of birth fits. And his brother Arthur Keller served on UB75 as well, he actually went down on it when she hit a mine Dec 10, 1917, all hands lost. 

What was passed down verbally to the family that of the 5 Keller brothers, all who served, one was an officer. 

I’m not sure this is him either, but there’s some things about this that makes me wonder.

[Cherelle]

@The Prussian  May I ask: What date was he listed at Landwehrbezirk Wesel? 

[The Prussian]

That was in the naval rank list 1918.

By the way. There are other naval officers named Keller in the ranklist of honour.

Karl, Karl-Paul, Waldemar, Paul, Henry, Albert, Ernst, Heinrich (Doctor).

I checked a naval-uniform book too. The cap is an officers cap.  So I´d say "my Willy is your Willy", but that doesn´t sound good... ,

so I´d say, if the naval ranklist ain´t wrong, that guy must be your Mr. Willy Keller.

I forgot to say, that he was a reserve-officer.

Ranklist 1918:

Edited 19 February , 2018 by The Prussian

[Cherelle]

Many thanks for the information. And the humour!

so far, this is the closest match. I’m not able to say 100%, if only there was a further record with his place of birth. But it’s a great place for me to start, and I appreciate the help greatly! I will take that birth date along with this info and do some more research. 

[FROGSMILE]

His being a reserve officer and employed later as a military judge would explain how he survived, the U-Boat crew attrition rate was extraordinary.

Edited 20 February , 2018 by FROGSMILE