Help with War Diary. Pte T. F. Moncrieff, ASC.

[DoubleD]

M2/098869, Private Thomas Fletcher Moncrieff, Army Service Corps.

 

I  am hoping that someone can help me to find a War diary entry for this man, who died of wounds on 26th April 1918. I have a reference to a war diary extract from some time ago which says "At Poperinghe. Usual supply duty. 21st Division train slightly wounded by shellfire." Unfortunately I can't remember where it came from!

 

i have tried entering the details into TNA, but no success I'm afraid. Probably my fault, because of my inexperience I'm not entering the right information.

 

I am really excited to have just been contacted by the great-niece of this man, who will be able to come to his remembrance ceremony in April at the school which he attended. I would love to be able to give her as much information as I can about what his unit were doing when he died.

 

Many thanks,

Dave

[Ron Clifton]

Hello Dave

 

The M2 prefix to his service number  indicates that he was in a Mechanical Transport Company of the ASC. He was probably with this unit, whose War Diary can be downloaded from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk:

WO 95/762 21 Divisional Supply Column (273 Company A.S.C.) 1916 June - 1919 May  

 

You may need to add a suffix such as /1, /2 etc as there are two or more diaries in the file. War Diaries rarely mention individuals by name other than officers, but numbers of casualties each day are nearly always given, and the location of the unit, with a short description of its activities, is given on each day.

 

Ron

[DoubleD]

Hello Ron,

 

Thank you so much for your help.

 

I understand what you say about the war diaries not mentioning anyone by name, but I think this lady would just like to know a bit more about the area where her great-uncle died. I think I should order it anyway in the hope that she finds it useful.

 

Thanks again, as ever there is always someone on this forum who is prepared to share their expertise with us novices.

 

Dave

[MaxD]

The Commonwealth War Graves Commission details confirm that he was with 21st Division's train https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/93963/moncrieff,-thomas-fletcher/ . The CWGC details for the cemetery (note the troops name for it "Bandaghem) in which he is buried says that the cemetery site was chosen in July 1917 for the 62nd and 63rd Casualty Clearing Stations and burials from these and other hospitals (notably the 36th Casualty Clearing Station in 1918) continued until October 1918. The locations  of these can be found on the Long Long Trail at http://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/locations-of-british-casualty-clearing-stations/

The MT Company diary will certainly give an idea of the general area in which it was operating and you can pin point the locations of the three CCSs on a present day map.  You can also download a commemorative certificate from the CWGC site.

 

This site may also be of interest.  However, as is usual, the concentration is on the battles fought by the infantry and the cavalry, your man's job was not so glamorous but arguably equally important ferrying supplies back and forth  and, as his sad death attest, just as dangerous. The Lon Long Trail again has a useful bit about the ASC MT Companies working as Divisional Supply Columns (21 Div not yet listed)

 

Forgive me if you have all this.

 

I hesitate to take issue with Ron but I believe he has the wrong diary .  The ORBAT for 21 Division has the Divisional Train comprising 182, 183, 184 and 185 Companies ASC.  There are two diaries covering two time periods, WO 95/2149/2 and 95/2150.  I have had the quickest of checks on the later one (2150)  and in April 1918 they were all working in the area of Poperinghe where they were being shelled heavily in mid April which accords with his death in Bandaghem.  See later post

 

MaxD

 

Edited 1 February , 2018 by MaxD
Correction

[DoubleD]

Hi MaxD,

 

My thanks to you also.

 

I will pass on your very useful links to the lady concerned, and see what she wants to do from there.

 

Cheers,

Dave

[MaxD]

Dave  I was about to hedge my bets and await Ron's comment.  I am admitting to doubts in that the 21 Div Train companies I cited were I think all horse drawn whereas the Corps troops 273 Company were mechanised and as he says, Moncrieff's number indicates an MT man rather than a horse transport man.

 

I apologise for the indecision, hope to hear from Ron soon.

 

MaxD.

 

[MaxD]

Further.

 

Ron is absolutely right (and my doubts about my own finding were well based).  Acting on the basis of putting my money where my mouth was, I downloaded the diary cited by Ron WO 92/762-6 (my good deed for the day).

 

.26 April 1918 - ""Private Moncrieff wounded and admitted to hospital yesterday"

 

Back soon with the location on a map.

 

Ron - my apologies for the doubt.

 

Max

 

 

[MaxD]

While the diary doesn't say exactly where Pte Moncrieff was wounded, the map reference given for the day is just to the west of Poperinghe.  The side by side map at this link

http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by-side/#zoom=14&lat=50.8379&lon=2.6802&layers=101464879&right=BingHyb.

 

The reference is in square 21 (left hand map), in the lower right hand quadrant. If you mouse over it, on the right hand present day map it is about where the M333 road label is.  Poperinghe is the town appearing at the top right corner of the map.

 

Hope that makes up for my indecision and doubting Thomas act previously, feeling better now!

 

Max

 

 

[DoubleD]

I now have the War Diary, and have passed all of the information on to the great-niece of Thomas Moncrieff.

 

Again, my thanks to Ron and Max for their expertise, and generous assistance.

 

 

Cheers,

Dave