WWI Enlistment Date Needed from Regimental Number

[John Vickers]

Can anyone help me pinpoint the enlistment date for Henry Stanley Gwynne 306912, Royal Warwickshire Regiment?

I've an idea it may have been August 1914, but that was a calculated guess.

I don't have Soldiers Effects so don't know War Gratuity I'm afraid.

Thanks.

[abbrover]

He was a Second Lieutenant when he died, so his service papers should be at the National Archives Kew The reference for his file is WO374/29894

Edited 29 January , 2018 by abbrover

[ss002d6252]

56 minutes ago, John Vickers said:

Can anyone help me pinpoint the enlistment date for Henry Stanley Gwynne 306912, Royal Warwickshire Regiment?

I've an idea it may have been August 1914, but that was a calculated guess.

I don't have Soldiers Effects so don't know War Gratuity I'm afraid.

Thanks.

When was he commissioned and do we know the rank he was as a NCO - from that I can work it for you.

Found it.
 

H S Gwynne was paid £18 war gratuity for his services prior to commission on 1 Aug 17.

As a Corporal he was paid £6 for the first 12 months + 24 months at 10s = 36 months. This would indicate enlistment in the month from 2 Aug 1914  (in real terms the earliest qualifying date is 5 Aug 1914 ).

Craig

Edited 29 January , 2018 by ss002d6252
edited for clarity

[John Vickers]

Thanks yet again Craig!

 

John

[ss002d6252]

8 minutes ago, John Vickers said:

Thanks yet again Craig!

 

John

No worries, keeps my mind going. The war gratuity has, to me, been one of the most useful things to come out of ww1 records.

Craig

[John Vickers]

My guess was based on finding another casualty with a close Regimental Number where I had his Effects and therefore Gratuity. A two-step process I thought carried too much uncertainty to accept as probable.

[ss002d6252]

14 minutes ago, John Vickers said:

My guess was based on finding another casualty with a close Regimental Number where I had his Effects and therefore Gratuity. A two-step process I thought carried too much uncertainty to accept as probable.

Where possible it's always good to back up with nearby numbers to double check but the 'number alone' fails where a man had earlier service under a different and unknown number etc. The war gratuity can pick these things up once you know how to read them.

The way you did it would work fine to narrow it to within a month (and sometimes closer) - just trust the system

 

Craig

 

[John Vickers]

Just when you think you have something pinned down...

 

I've been working on his date of death as 24.11.17(CWGC and Headstone) but now realise other documents state 23.11.17 (S Effects - sorry, I didn't realise I had this all along) and 25.11.17 (Graves Registration Report Form)

 

He was killed by a bomb dropped from a German aircraft according to his obituary in the Western Mail - Friday 07 December 1917 (which also gives his death date as 23.11.17)

 

Lieutenant Gwynne was studying for the scholastic profession at Winchester College when at the outbreak of war he mobilised with the Hampshire regiment and served 10 months overseas, being promoted to Corporal and recommended for a commission on the field. After receiving his commission he proceeded overseas again about six weeks ago. He was engaged to Miss Eileen N. Mulligan of Victoria Park Avenue, Cardiff. His commanding officer writes: “He and two other officers of ours were killed by a bomb dropped from a German aeroplane whilst sitting in their company’s mess a few days ago. He was a very capable young officer who was deeply respected by all ranks of his battalion.

 

The Graves Registration Report Form also says he was 11th Btn. not 6th. I haven't been able to find any War Diary reference to this which is surprising for 3 officers being killed in one incident.

 

Any light that can be shed on this would be helpful.

Edited 30 January , 2018 by John Vickers
Clarification

[ss002d6252]

Quote

I've been working on his date of death as 24.11.17(CWGC and Headstone) but now realise other documents state 23.11.17 (S Effects - sorry, I didn't realise I had this all along) and 25.11.17 (Graves Registration Report Form)

I suspect the effects is right and the CWGC date is the date of the  report going through, which is commonly the next day.

Unusual that a death from aerial bombing, especially the death of several officers, would go un-noted. Have you tried the brigade and divisional diaries ?

Craig
 

[John Vickers]

Thanks. Turns out that he was 11th Btn. and there was an entry that I'd missed. It was terse but there. Tracked down by a roundabout route. Ancestry War Diaries really are poorly put together!

 

Still trying to understand the basics: why would his first service with the Hampshires be entirely missing from his Medal Card? I thought they always carried the first regiment.

[David_Underdown]

If he didn't serve overseas with the Hampshires it wouldn't be on the medal index card s they are only concerned with medal eligibility.