stephen p nunn Posted 25 January , 2018 Share Posted 25 January , 2018 Evening all. I have previously posted topics around my interest in Canada Farm CWGC (Ypres) and my search for the medals and stories behind the men buried there. The collection is growing and I am pleased to report that I have obtained the medals for another man commemorated there. Despite searching, the information on him at the moment is quite scant. This is it: Ernest Alexander COPSEY Born 1895, the son of Alice Copsey of 37 Dickeson Street, Kentish Town, London. He lived in Kentish Town. Enlisted at St. Pancras. First on Active Service in Egypt 7/10/1915. SDGW indicates he was in the Royal Horse Artillery and the Royal Field Artillery. However, his MIC indicates only the Royal Field Artillery. He served as a Gunner (84312) in "X" 29th Mortar Battery. He died on 12th July 1917 (aged 22) - presumably in the dressing Station Canada Farm. He is buried in the CWGC Canada Farm at I.C.26. He was entitled to the 1915 Star trio. However, I have only been able to get hold of the BWM and VM, the Star seems to be missing. Can anyone add anything to Ernest's story? I am particularly interested to know who he served with in Egypt, if he was in the RHA and RFA and what X29 MB were up to - especially on 12/7/17. Thanks all for your help. Best wishes. Stephen (Maldon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 25 January , 2018 Share Posted 25 January , 2018 (edited) Soldiers Effects on Ancestry shows a GBP 11 gratuity which suggests an enlistment date of February 1915 using Craig's Calculator The SDGW reference of RH and RFA is often grouped like that to distinguish from RGA. I would assume RFA unless you find further evidence. Edited 25 January , 2018 by charlie962 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen p nunn Posted 25 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 25 January , 2018 10 minutes ago, charlie962 said: Soldiers Effects on Ancestry shows a GBP 11 gratuity which suggests an enlistment date of February 1915 using Craig's Calculator The SDGW reference of RH and RFA is often grouped like that to distinguish from RGA. I would assume RFA unless you find further evidence. That's really helpful Charlie - thank you very much. So now we know when he enlisted. He was then off to Egypt some 8 months later. Regards. Stephen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 25 January , 2018 Share Posted 25 January , 2018 The Unit was 29 Divisional Trench Mortar Battery and its War Diary is here on Ancestry. Most unusually it names him the day of his death . He was acting as guide to a fatigue party. And given that 29th Division was in Gallipoli in 1915 he may well have joined them out ther? Worth checking their dates on the Long Long Trail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen p nunn Posted 25 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 25 January , 2018 4 minutes ago, charlie962 said: The Unit was 29 Divisional Trench Mortar Battery and its War Diary is here on Ancestry. Most unusually it names him the day of his death . He was acting as guide to a fatigue party. And given that 29th Division was in Gallipoli in 1915 he may well have joined them out ther? Worth checking their dates on the Long Long Trail. Wow - I have never had that happen before. Is it possible to reproduce exactly what it says about him please? Thank you so much. Regards. Stephen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 25 January , 2018 Share Posted 25 January , 2018 (edited) That'll cost you. Canal Bank, 13th July 1917 Fatigue party carrying up guns & put in 6,7. & 11. Gunner Copsey killed while acting as guide. Orders to stand by for SOS .... 6,7,11 are individual gunpits that they'd just taken over. By guns they mean the Trench Mortars. Charlie Edited 25 January , 2018 by charlie962 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen p nunn Posted 25 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 25 January , 2018 2 minutes ago, charlie962 said: That'll cost you. Canal Bank, 13th July 1917 Fatigue party carrying up guns & put in 6.7.x 11. Gunner Copsey killed while acting as guide. Orders to stand by for SOS .... Charlie Brilliant - thank you so much Charlie. regards. Stephen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 25 January , 2018 Share Posted 25 January , 2018 On the non military side I suspect he is of the Copseys in St Pancras, His father Charles Henry (died 1912) formerly Norfolk. Charles married Alice 1890. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Porter Posted 25 January , 2018 Share Posted 25 January , 2018 His number indicates arriving at No. 6 Depot RFA, Glasgow around January 26, 1915. His date of entry in Egypt is not tied to any particular units arrival, so I would say he was a reinforcement. It is fairly obvious he joined 29th Division at some point and probably made the journey with them from Egypt to France in March 1916. The Medium Trench Mortar Batteries would have been formed soon after this. It is so lucky to have him mentioned in the War Diary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alantwo Posted 25 January , 2018 Share Posted 25 January , 2018 Stephen Your man is recorded in the list of those killed, wounded or missing in the 29th Divisional Artillery War Record and Honours Book 1915-1918, but it doesn't add anything to what you already know. On a more general note the book does indicate that Trench Mortar Batteries were not on a permanent basis till the summer of 1916, but a "Trench Mortar Group" was temporarily organised during the Gallipoli campaign. Regards Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen p nunn Posted 25 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 25 January , 2018 Thank you so much Alan, David and Charlie. So with your fantastic information added, this is the latest on our man: Ernest Alexander COPSEY Born 1895, son of Charles Henry Copsey (originally from Norfolk. Died 1912) and Alice Copsey* of St. Pancras. (*They had married in 1890). Lived in Kentish town. Enlisted at St. Pancras in the Royal Field Artillery. His number indicates arriving at No. 6 Depot RFA, Glasgow around January 26, 1915. First on Active Service in Egypt 7/10/1915. His date of entry in Egypt is not tied to any particular unit’s arrival, so he was probably a reinforcement. He joined 29th Division at some point. The 29thDivision was in Gallipoli in 1915 and a "Trench Mortar Group" was temporarily organised during the Gallipoli campaign. He probably made the journey with the 29th from Egypt to France in March 1916. The Medium Trench Mortar Batteries would have been formed on a permanent basis in the summer of 1916 and he served as Gunner (84312) in “X” 29th Mortar Battery, Royal Field Artillery. (29th Divisional Trench Mortar Battery). Died 12th July 1917 (aged 22) – according to the War Diary. whilst acting as a guide for a fatigue party. It reads: “Canal Bank, 13th July 1917. Fatigue party carrying up guns & put in 6.7.x 11. Gunner Copsey killed while acting as guide. Orders to stand by for SOS ....”. Buried Canada Farm (I.C.26). Soldiers Effects show that there was a Gratuity of GBP 11. Entitled to the 1915 Star trio. Mother, Alice Copsey, then lived at 37 Dickeson Street, Kentish Town, London. He is recorded in the list of those killed, wounded or missing in the 29th Divisional Artillery War Record and Honours Book 1915-1918. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen p nunn Posted 28 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 28 January , 2018 Thanks to friends on the GWF this is the very latest story on Ernest. Have we now wrung it dry? Regards. Stephen (Maldon) Ernest Alexander COPSEY Gunner (84312) Royal Field Artillery Birth and early life Born in St. Pancras in 1895, the son of Charles Henry Copsey (originally from Norfolk. A French Polisher who died 1912) and Alice Copsey (née Willis - who was Charing). (They had married in 1890). 1901 – (aged 6) living with his father (30), mother (20) and two older sisters, Beatrice (9) and Lilie (7), at 13 Allcroft Road, St. Pancras. 1911 – (aged 16) living with his father, mother, two sisters and uncle at 6 Tovey Place, Kentish Town. Ernest was working as “Pianoforte” (presumably polishing). Enlistment and training Enlisted at St. Pancras in the Royal Field Artillery – possibly straight into the 29th Division. The 29th, consisting of units that arrived from the most distant stations, was formed in the Stratford-Warwick-Leamington-Rugby-Nuneaton area of Warwickshire in January-March 1915. His number indicates arriving at No. 6 Depot RFA, Glasgow around January 26, 1915. Originally intended for France, pressure on Lord Kitchener to launch a ground attack at Gallipoli forced him to deploy the 29th Division there. The 29th Division embarked at Avonmouth on 16-22 March 1915 and went via Malta to Alexandria. On 7 April the first units to have arrived at Egypt began to re-embark for the move to Mudros, the deep water harbour at the island of Imbros that was going to be used as a forward base for operations at Gallipoli. The Division landed at Cape Helles on Gallipoli on 25 April 1915 and subsequently took part in the Gallipoli campaign. Service in Gallipoli Ernest was first on Active Service in Egypt 7/10/1915. His date of entry in Egypt is not tied to any particular unit’s arrival, so he was probably a reinforcement for Gallipoli - a "Trench Mortar Group" was temporarily organised during the Gallipoli campaign. On the nights 7-8 January 1916, the Division was evacuated from Gallipoli and all units returned to Egypt. Orders were received there on 25 February for a move to France. Embarking in March it arrived at Marseilles and moved to concentrate in the area east of Pont Remy between 15 and 29 March. Move to France Ernest would have made the journey with the 29th from Egypt to France in March 1916. The Medium Trench Mortar Batteries would have been formed on a permanent basis in the summer of 1916 and he served in “X” 29th Mortar Battery, Royal Field Artillery. (29th Divisional Trench Mortar Battery). The 29th was engaged on the Somme in; The Battle of Albert (July 1916) and The Battle of the Transloy Ridges (Oct./Nov. 1916). Then in 1917 it took part in the First, Second and Third Battles of the Scarpe (phases of the Arras Offensive in April/May 1917). Transfer to Belgium Ernest and his Battery then moved to Ypres and dug in at the Canal Bank. Death Died 12th July 1917 (aged 22) – according to the War Diary. whilst acting as a guide for a fatigue party. It reads: “Canal Bank, 13th July 1917. Fatigue party carrying up guns & put in 6.7.x 11. Gunner Copsey killed while acting as guide. Orders to stand by for SOS ....”. Commemoration Buried Canada Farm (I.C.26). Soldiers Effects show that there was a Gratuity of GBP 11. Entitled to the 1915 Star trio. Mother, Alice Copsey, then lived at 37 Dickeson Street, Kentish Town, London. He is recorded in the list of those killed, wounded or missing in the 29th Divisional Artillery War Record and Honours Book 1915-1918. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen p nunn Posted 30 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 30 January , 2018 I don't suppose anyone has ever seen a photograph of Ernest Copsey or knows of any UK war memorial commemoration to him please? Thank you. Stephen (Maldon). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen p nunn Posted 1 February , 2018 Author Share Posted 1 February , 2018 It looks like an officer from the same Trench Mortar Battery ("X" 29th) died the following day (13/7/17). He is also buried at Canada Farm. His name was Lieutenant Walter Edward RUSSELL (31) - husband of Catherine E. Russell of 31 Seymour Street, Portsmouth. I wonder if his story will open up anything further about Ernest? Regards. Stephen (Maldon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 2 February , 2018 Share Posted 2 February , 2018 18 hours ago, stephen p nunn said: I wonder if his story will open up anything further about Ernest? Whilst it is always worth checking the War Diary or even Newspaper reports, I got the impression that Copsey's death was a specific incident of bad luck, shell falling in the wrong place at the wrong time! The War Diary was pretty clear on this and as I said, unusual in naming the man. But look at the Ancestry War Diary link anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 2 February , 2018 Share Posted 2 February , 2018 18 hours ago, stephen p nunn said: Walter Edward RUSSELL In fact WE Russell had taken over temporary command of Z/29 two days earlier and it was with them that he was killed on 13th. So no connection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen p nunn Posted 2 February , 2018 Author Share Posted 2 February , 2018 OK - thanks for your further help Charlie. Best regards. Stephen (Maldon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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