sabre Posted 6 January , 2018 Share Posted 6 January , 2018 (edited) My friend has just purchased a 1916 dated Model 1873 Artillery sword with the scabbard Unit marked K.S. 147 does this stand for kaiserliche schutztruppe ?. Edited 6 January , 2018 by sabre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolyboy11 Posted 8 January , 2018 Share Posted 8 January , 2018 I have seen a couple of similar marked artillery swords over the years and initially wondered the same. K.S. marking on some swords can indeed refer to Schutztruppen but it seems that this model of sword was not issued in South West Africa. Also the 1916 date would preclude this as the colony surrendered to South African forces in 1915. It is though seen in pictures from the German Chinese colony of Tsingtao pre 1914. ........ Under the 1922 abbreviations it is for Cavalry school - Kavallerie Schule waffe Nr.147. Examples commonly have the '1920' stamp on the reverse side of the crossguard. Hope this helps. Rolyboy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabre Posted 9 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 9 January , 2018 Ok thanks Rolyboy I will get some pics of my friends sword added as there are other markings as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabre Posted 11 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 11 January , 2018 Pics of Unit markings and markings on scabbard mouthpiece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolyboy11 Posted 12 January , 2018 Share Posted 12 January , 2018 Sabre ......Presume from your pics this marking not repeated on the sword? Matching unit marks for these would normally appear both on the sword & scabbard. (Sometimes on the sword only.) If only on scabbard, then this has been mis-matched at some point in its life. The original sword would most likely have been marked as described earlier. Again hope this helps. Rolyboy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabre Posted 13 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 13 January , 2018 Yes no markings on sword Rolyboy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 14 January , 2018 Share Posted 14 January , 2018 I am quite unfamiliar with this type of Seitengewehr but under the 1909 regulations, then K is for "Kommando, Kanonen, Kuerassier, Kriegschule", and S is for "Shuetzen, Sanitaetas-Kompagnie, Schiessschule, Feldsignal-Abteilung". BUT, Bavarian regulations for 1872 have KS for "Kriegsschule"... My guess? Scabbard is older than the 1916-marked 'sword', and is Bavarian and marked for "Kriegsschule Waffe 147". Happy - as always! - to be corrected! Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolyboy11 Posted 15 January , 2018 Share Posted 15 January , 2018 As noted, the KS ones I have seen over the years ( 2 or 3) have all had the 1920 stamp, so post war markings ie. 1922 regs. or maybe later. As the sword is not matching it will remain something of an unknown, but nothing suggests the scabbard is any older, although of course it may be................ Sadly, they did not seem to '1920' the scabbards as well, which would have helped. I seem to think this pattern of sword remained in service into the 1930's ? Rolyboy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabre Posted 17 January , 2018 Author Share Posted 17 January , 2018 Ok thanks all, have one of these myself 1916 but no unit markings only acceptance marks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 18 January , 2018 Share Posted 18 January , 2018 On 1/15/2018 at 19:46, rolyboy11 said: As noted, the KS ones I have seen over the years ( 2 or 3) have all had the 1920 stamp, so post war markings ie. 1922 regs. or maybe later. Post WW1 marks are very distinctive. The usual format for the early Reichswehr was - if I remember correctly - along the lines of: company/eskadron/batterie number; back-slash; unit abbreviation; unit number; weapon number. So. e.g.," 2./A.R.1.4." would be "2.Batterie, Artillerie-Regiment Nr.1, Waffe Nr. 4. Again, off-hand, I am pretty certain there was a directive issued even before November 1918(!) that stipulated how the S.84/98 was to be the standard post-war "sidearm", and that was re-confirmed in the 1930's, I think. I can check if you need to know! BUT, I don't have any of these artillery swords and I have no idea what else that scabbard might fit... Is it the regulation type for the M.1873? Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now