Objectives map 3rd Battle of Ypres 31st July 1917

[robertlarbey]

I'm sure this is already here somewhere on the site, but does anyone have a map showing the initial coloured objective lines for the first phases of the 3rd Battle of Ypres from 31st July 1917 through to the 10th August? Especially covering towards the Westhoek area, which I believe was the 8th Division followed by the 25th Division. 

 

Thanks 

 

Robert

[BFBSM]

Menin Road Map:

https://www.awm.gov.au/sites/default/files/Menin_Road_1.pdf

https://www.awm.gov.au/sites/default/files/Menin_Road_2.pdf

 

These maps are found linked within this page: https://www.awm.gov.au/articles/blog/battle-of-passchendaele-third-ypres

 

Mark

[robertlarbey]

Thanks very much for this information, Mark. Amazing detail.

 

I am going over there next week where my gt uncle fell near Sexton House (28.J. 1. b. 2. 2) on 2nd August 1917. Got quite a lot of information gathered for events leading up to that point, except what the exact original objectives where.

 

So the links to the maps that you have kindly supplied are slightly after the period that I'm after. It's zero+ hour 31st July 1917 that I'm looking for, but no later than, say, the 10th August.

 

Also, while I've got you (and anyone else reading this), any detail involving the 31st July to 2nd August 1917 on that left flank of the 8th Div between the Westhoek Ridge and the Ypres / Roulers railway. Now called Frezenbergstraat road.

 

I mention the 8th Div because it was the 8th Div who had done all the hard work up until that point before the 25th Div took over on the 1st August. My uncle was actually in the 8th South Lancs, which was part of the 75th Brigade, 25th Div who took over from the 8th Div on the 1st. And then he was killed the next day. Probably as a result of the German counter attack slightly north of his position at 1.30pm on the 2nd. But it would be interesting to know of any accounts of activity around that time and that location, objective maps and photos.

 

Although there's nothing left of Sexton House or Kit & Kat blockhouse (looking at the sat view), I might brave knocking on a few doors while I'm there to see if there's maybe something left behind. You never know, there might be a freindly face, a cup of tea and a piece of shrapnel to make it all worth while.

 

Thanks again

 

Robert

[Don Regiano]

Hi Robert.

 

I would be interested in learning about anything further you may find.  One of my relatives was in 8 South Lancs and died of his wounds on 5 August 1917.  He is buried at Brandhoek New Military Cemetery.  As you probably know, the war diary doesn't shed a great deal of light on events.  I haven't yet checked to see if there is anything further in the Brigade's diary.

 

Regards.

 

Reg

 

 

[BFBSM]

Robert,

I have this scanned image from the official history:

 

This is a link to a trench map of 3 July, 1917. As the objectives were the German trenches of the you may be able to work out the objectives in the area from it. The map is located over a Google map of the area, and by using the 'Change transparency of overlay' slider you can reveal the Google Map to different degrees.

 

I hope this helps, and that some other Pals may correct the situation if I am wrong.

 

Mark

[Fattyowls]

Robert

 

Like my friend Reg I too have an interest in this area at around the same time, so this thread has already been really helpful. My interest is in James Brannick of the 11th Lancashire Fusiliers who was killed on 10th August probably on the northeastern side of Westhoek. The war diaries for the unit are very good, typewritten and full of map references for the dispositions. I need to feed these into the excellent trench map reference converter but I fear the area is now covered by the motorway junction; on my two visits to the area I couldn't find a good angle for a photo. I am very grateful to Mark for the maps which are excellent.

 

Serendipity is almost the word for it.

 

Pete.

[Battlefield Photography]

I'm preparing a photo blogpost about the subject.Does anyone have more details on the actions around 10th of August and more specific the capture of westhoek ( names of specific objectives , details of captured strongholds) ? 

@Pete 

Were can I get me a copy of the unit's war diary? Seems like good research material.  Does anyone know were the jump off line was? I think it was around Stirling castle and the Menin road . 

 

Best regards,

[robertlarbey]

Thank you, everyone, for your contribution to this thread. The slider maps are a real asset because it means I can stand by the exact spot where my uncle fell with pin point accuracy. 

 

The 31st July map is exactly what I'm after.  Thanks for that. 

 

Best of luck with your individual researching! 

 

Robert

[Fattyowls]

On 26/07/2017 at 06:59, Battlefield Photography said:

I'm preparing a photo blogpost about the subject.Does anyone have more details on the actions around 10th of August and more specific the capture of westhoek ( names of specific objectives , details of captured strongholds) ? 

@Pete 

Were can I get me a copy of the unit's war diary? Seems like good research material.  Does anyone know were the jump off line was? I think it was around Stirling castle and the Menin road . 

 

Best regards,

 

Hi BP

 

Sorry for the delay  responding. The war diaries of the 11th are available on Ancestry or can be downloaded from the UK National archives for a small fee. I don't know if there are any issues if you are trying to access either of these sources from Belgian cyberspace, maybe someone else will be able to comment. The action on the 10th appears to have taken place in the triangle between the current motorway, the N37 and roughly Frezenbergstraat, although the diary entries are a bit confusing. I've tried to photograph in the area a couple of times and while the view backs towards Ieper, Bellewaarde and Hooge I've not managed a good photo looking the other way. I hope you will be able to find a good vista, I'd be very interested to see what you can find.

 

Pete.

[Fattyowls]

4 hours ago, robertlarbey said:

Thank you, everyone, for your contribution to this thread. The slider maps are a real asset because it means I can stand by the exact spot where my uncle fell with pin point accuracy. 

 

The 31st July map is exactly what I'm after.  Thanks for that. 

 

Best of luck with your individual researching! 

 

Robert

 

Robert, really glad that you have got what you need; I think everyone has got something out of it which is what a good thread should do. Good work.

 

Pete.

[BFBSM]

17 hours ago, robertlarbey said:

Thank you, everyone, for your contribution to this thread. The slider maps are a real asset because it means I can stand by the exact spot where my uncle fell with pin point accuracy. 

 

The 31st July map is exactly what I'm after.  Thanks for that. 

 

Best of luck with your individual researching! 

 

Robert

 

I am glad to have been able to help, if only in a small way. Good luck with your trip, and I hope you are able to complete the task you have set yourself. I would love to hear how you go.

 

Mark

[Robert Dunlop]

On 23/07/2017 at 08:34, robertlarbey said:

I'm sure this is already here somewhere on the site, but does anyone have a map showing the initial coloured objective lines for the first phases of the 3rd Battle of Ypres from 31st July 1917 through to the 10th August? Especially covering towards the Westhoek area, which I believe was the 8th Division followed by the 25th Division. 

Robert, there is a long thread here:

 

It covers the planning and then execution of Third Ypres, with specific focus on Gheluvelt Ridge. The Westhoek area features at several points in the discussion.

 

Robert