Mercantile Marine Torpedo Badge

[depaor01]

Afternoon all,

 

A colleague has introduced me to this item posthumously awarded to Joseph Hopkins who went down with the SS Hare. I understand it was awarded to seamen who were serving on torpedoed ships.

Anyone have Chapter and Verse on this one? I've never come across the award. The slip accompanying the badge mentions stars and bars and how they should be worn, but I don't see anything online showing these insignia in wear.

 

 

 

Thanks,

 

Dave

Edited 4 May , 2017 by depaor01

[MerchantOldSalt]

National Archives File MT9/1300 deals with the award of the torpedo badge to Merchant Seamen and if memory serves me right somebody was actually guilty of the offence mentioned in paragraph (4) of your attachment, illegally supplying badges that is.

 

The badge was authorised 6th June 1918 and was awarded to those seamen whose ships had been sunk, or damaged, by submarine or mine and had then gone on to sail on further voyages on British ships lasting at least a month.  If they were subsequently torpedoed or mined again, then a bar was worn underneath the badge on the cuff.  If they continued to be unfortunate in their coming to grips with the enemy, then further bars were issued until five could be swapped for a five pointed star.  I would have thought at this point that any man would probably have had enough of the seagoing life and called it a day!

 

Certificated Officers and various other officers were able to change the red badge for a gold wire one at a later date in 1918. 

 

I understand that this is a pretty rare thing to have, I suspect that Merchant Seamen, the majority of them not wearing a uniform at this time, felt that they had no where to put the badge even if it does say it could be worn on the cuff of your suit!  Also, it had to be applied for and I imagine the greater number could not be bothered, if there had been a monetary award they would have been queuing up at the Merchant Shipping Offices in droves, but that is only my thoughts on the subject but might explain why there are, apparently, so few of them about.  Those liner companies who did supply their crew with uniforms, might well have not permitted such a badge sullying their company livery, but again I'm only surmising.

 

Tony

 

 

[depaor01]

Thanks Tony for that.

In the case of someone who earned the badge  and was torpedoed and went down with the ship, does it follow that he (she) must have bee torpedoed or mined once before and went back on service? 

 

Dave

[johnboy]

That's how I read it Dave. Somewhere I think I read of a man who had been on 5 ships sunk by subs.

[depaor01]

Wow. That is such an understated award for heroism like that. 

 

Dave

[johnboy]

Not so much heroism  just good luck. He probably had no choice but to stay at sea. I wonder what the other crew thought of him? Sounds a bit like Uncle Albert in Fools and Horses. 

[depaor01]

Wouldn't agree there at all Johnboy. It seems his ship was attacked once, he went to sea again and was lost at sea after another attack.

Pretty heroic in my book.

Dave

[MerchantOldSalt]

2 hours ago, depaor01 said:

Thanks Tony for that.

In the case of someone who earned the badge  and was torpedoed and went down with the ship, does it follow that he (she) must have bee torpedoed or mined once before and went back on service? 

 

Dave

You have spotted the bit I cannot find an answer to, if the seaman died the first time his ship was mined or torpedoed was he eligible for the badge?  Afraid I cannot answer that from the file or other research as yet.

Tony

[depaor01]

Thanks for the info Tony. Logic would suggest a return to merchant seafaring after an enemy attack would be a requirement. 

Dave

[johnboy]

5 hours ago, depaor01 said:

Wouldn't agree there at all Johnboy. It seems his ship was attacked once, he went to sea again and was lost at sea after another attack.

Pretty heroic in my book.

Dave

 

 

Sorry Dave but I did not mean that he was not a brave man but that he may have had no choice but to return to sea after his ordeal.

[depaor01]

I misunderstood your point sorry. Yes I suspect that the poor house would have been the only alternative. A common story I should think.

Dave

[Jed Stu]

The recipient of the Merchant Navy ‘red torpedo’ patch, a Merchant Seaman, this was issued after he’d survived the sinking of his ship by either a German U-boat torpedo or by a mine. Following the issue of the torpedo patch, if the recipients next ship followed the same fate, he would receive a bar of the same colour, to be placed beneath the torpedo patch on his uniform signifying and showing quite easily that he’d been on two destroyed ‘sunk’ ships... and he’d survived! 

My grandfather survived three German u-boat torpedoes, and three ships going ‘down’, whilst travelling three times around the world during the Great War, supplying food, ammunition and horses to all of the fighting troops.

 Great men and women of their time, during both and all wars!