7t2ndswinger Posted 9 December , 2004 Share Posted 9 December , 2004 I'm hoping someone will be able to help me identify the attached Essex Regiment Badge. It appears to be silver as the loops certainy are, but is a composite badge manufactured the same way as a bi-metal one. The sphinx and regimental name scroll are overlays and the SA scroll is tagged on and not integral. The badge is die stamped and not cast. What is more puzzling is the Egypt honour is still present as a 4th-7th Btns would have had this blank and an 8th would be as theirs but would not carry the SA scroll. 1st VB would have the this title instead of Egypt and carry the SA scroll. My guess is this may be an officers personal comission. Your thoughts please ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBettsMCDCM Posted 9 December , 2004 Share Posted 9 December , 2004 I think you are probably Right an Officer's ,Privately commissioned Silver/White Metal badge, based on the TF Battalion Badge,but retaining the Egypt scroll to which they were not entitled,the Militia Battalion,wore a White Metal badge with Gilding Metal Scrolls,The Volunteers usually a W/M{Nickel} Badge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbrydon Posted 9 December , 2004 Share Posted 9 December , 2004 Similar to KK1577 but with Egypt rather than 1st.V.B. on the top scroll.I am sure an Essex specialist will know which Bns were entitled to the South Africa 1900-1902 battle honour, but I would have though it belonged to one of the Essex V.B.s Westlake ( The Territorial Battalions ) shows a line drawing of a similar badge with a blank top scroll but dosnt make it clear which battalions badge it is. Peter Brydon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Maclean Posted 9 December , 2004 Share Posted 9 December , 2004 The sphinx and tablet look like silver as does the rest of the badge but it looks different to rest of the badge. Could this have belonged to someone that transferred, had the badge altered but wanted to maintain a link with his previous service. Yeah, tenuous I know but the best I can come up with. If any Essex experts do come in can you tell me about this one. It's not mentioned in K&K or any other reference that I have. I've tried the regimental museum, they said it looks like a genuine badge but haven't a clue as to what, where, when etc. Sorry for any hi-jacking. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7t2ndswinger Posted 9 December , 2004 Author Share Posted 9 December , 2004 The sphinx and tablet look like silver as does the rest of the badge but it looks different to rest of the badge. Could this have belonged to someone that transferred, had the badge altered but wanted to maintain a link with his previous service. Yeah, tenuous I know but the best I can come up with. If any Essex experts do come in can you tell me about this one. It's not mentioned in K&K or any other reference that I have. I've tried the regimental museum, they said it looks like a genuine badge but haven't a clue as to what, where, when etc. Sorry for any hi-jacking. Jim Hi again Jim, Thanks for your efforts in trying to trace this one down. My next point of call was Chelmsford but you've saved me a visit ! The Sphinx does look different in the photo but I think this is an effect of the scan as it's on a slightly higher plane and probably a bit more polished than the rest of the badge. Unfortunately there is no imprint on the rear of the badge as to what is on the front, either on the tablet or regimental scroll so it's impossible to see if a blank tablet has been covered by an Egypt one. Your idea about someone maintaining a tradition is I think probably closest to the truth, who knows? Maybe a retired regular officer returning to service as a volunteer/territiorial but wanting his troops to know his past history, hence his commissioning of a unique badge. A glorious thought and I'd love to have met him. Altering a badge by DIY is almost impossible as they were so well made. I recently tried to take the scroll and coronet off a restrike Leinsters badge to put onto a genuine one which had those components damaged. I used a 75 watt soldering iron and they wouldn't budge. There must have been some serious burns in the factories of the badge manufacturers. I wouln't like to have tried this with the old gastove heated irons of the past if I'd been trying to adapt this badge, especially with something which would require working at such a high temperature as silver! Thanks for your help Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBettsMCDCM Posted 9 December , 2004 Share Posted 9 December , 2004 I used a 75 watt soldering iron and they wouldn't budge. These Badges were "Brazed",@ high temperature using Brazing Rods of a similar Metal alloy with a slightly lower Melting Temperature Threshold,,than the Metals being Brazed.A soldering Iron wouldn't get anywhere Hot Enough,even a Gas Burner would take a while to get hot enough,This badge doesn't look mucked about with,Just an Oddity,that is not recorded{K&K do state that they do not Show EVERY Badge but a representative selection~Your best bet might be to contact The MHS,or one of the Authors{K & K or John Gaylor who might be able to give a Better definition~they have been helpful to me in the past} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandsonMichael Posted 9 December , 2004 Share Posted 9 December , 2004 Hi Keith & others, I don't no much abour badges at all...I bought one a while back and it looks very similar to the one Jim posted. Both the 1st and 2nd Battalions Essex Regiment bear the Battle Honour South Africa 1899-02 upon the King's Colour. I don't know if that means they are allowed to add to their badge..... Note the difference between the Honour: 1899-02 and what is shown on the badge posted by Keith: 1900-1902. And that badge sure looks as though someone worked on it with a sledge hammer and a blow torch when you compare all three badges. Hope this is not confusing the matter, Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandsonMichael Posted 9 December , 2004 Share Posted 9 December , 2004 Someone just hijacked my badge! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Fisher Posted 9 December , 2004 Share Posted 9 December , 2004 Your best bet might be to contact The MHS,or one of the Authors{K & K or John Gaylor who might be able to give a Better definition~they have been helpful to me in the past} John Gaylor passed away on June 26th 2000. Apart from writing one of the most important works in the field of badge collecting, he was an active member of the Military Historical Society for over thirty years. This is one truly valuable resource no longer available to us. The MHS continue to provide a wide range of articles in their quarterly Bulletin. Membership is worth a tenner of anyone's money. Graeme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7t2ndswinger Posted 9 December , 2004 Author Share Posted 9 December , 2004 Thank you for your efforts to all out there. I think this badge is a real enigma and is going to take some solving to get to the bottom of!! If Chemsford can't help than who can ?? For the record Cox's book shows both the 4-7th Btns with the SA scroll and EGYPT tablet and the 8th Btn. with the blank tablet and no scroll. He mentions the former as being bi-metal but not the latter which I can confirm is also. Attached is a scan. Regarding GrandsonMichaels note about the 1900-02, both the territorial and VB badges carry the 1900-02 scroll as far as I'm aware although there are possibly anomalities like the 19th London for example. The H&SE would have a field day in a badge manufactures premises these days and a blow torch and sledgehammer are probably closer to the truth than one would expect !! Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Maclean Posted 10 December , 2004 Share Posted 10 December , 2004 The reason that I posted my badge is that the gilding metal portion has been blackened. This is not mentioned in any of the books and appears to have been done at the time of manufacture. Perhaps the museum will be able to assist with other badges. I have to say they were very helpful to me or at least tried to be. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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