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Remembered Today:

Which Division of RFA was he in?


kellysmith1976
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Ive been looking into my Great Grandfathers Service records. I can not find any division or regiment at all..

His name was Alfred William Rogers. He was born Oct 1884 Rochester, Kent.

He was a Driver in RFA .. I have his service records, But i can find no other info other than his number which was 156749.

 

I would love to know where he was, what his regiment were doing.. He has a couple of punishment reports in his service records. but doesnt say where other than 'in the field' 

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The punishment records carry the names of two officers who would be battery commanders. There is a chance that Forum member @rflory may be able to tell you the units under the charge of the following:

 

Major C.A.E. Cadell on March 30, 1917 (possibly C/75 Bty, Guards Division, as written on his medal card - he was awarded a Military Cross) 

Captain R. B. Siegal on August 18, 1917

 

Other than that, it is a pity so few sheets of service record survive and none of them show a unit. All I can see is that he went to France in 1917.

Edited by David Porter
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1 hour ago, kellysmith1976 said:

I can not find any division or regiment at all..

 

You will not find a regiment as he didnt serve with one. The RFA is a "corps". His unit will have been attached to a division and, with no service papers to help, I agree with David that trying to identify which unit the two officers served with is going to be the best (and possibly only) way forward. Their service files probably still exist at the National Archives in the file grouping of WO339 and WO374. These files are not available online and you'd have to visit the Archives, or pay a researcher to look for you.

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Hi,

 

2 hours ago, David Porter said:

The punishment records carry the names of two officers who would be battery commanders. There is a chance that Forum member @rflory may be able to tell you the units under the charge of the following:

 

Major C.A.E. Cadell on March 30, 1917 (possibly C/75 Bty, Guards Division, as written on his medal card - he was awarded a Military Cross) 

Captain R. B. Siegal on August 18, 1917

 

The MC register confirms that Cadell was with C/75 when his action resulted in the award

Cadell.jpg

 

In the 75 Brigade war diary for August 1917 there reference to a Captain Seigne of C/75

 

Regards

Chris

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2 hours ago, clk said:

In the 75 Brigade war diary for August 1917 there reference to a Captain Seigne of C/75

 

That is not what it looks like to me, but signatures are deceptive.

Siegal.jpg

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Hi,

 

Thinking out aloud...

 

1 hour ago, David Porter said:

That is not what it looks like to me, but signatures are deceptive

 

That definitely looks like Siegal, but would it be his actual signature, or just an interpretation by someone who had the responsibility for maintaining the records away from the unit, and might not have known the officer?

 

I didn't find a Siegal in the long number indices, but did find Seigne, which cross referencing to MC details, shows that he was attached to C/75.

 

GWF_2.jpg

 

It would be nice to resolve the issue, but is it that necessary? Whilst I guess that Cadell could have moved between units (a detailed check of the diary would probably confirm, or otherwise), it would seem likely that Alfred was with C/75 when he was disciplined in March 1917 for being late on parade, and having a dirty harness. I guess that the problem in helping Kelly is establishing whether Alfred always served with that battery (and when precisely in 1917 he arrived). If he did, then the answer to her original question would seem to lie in the contents of their diary - here at the National Archives, or here on Ancestry.

 

Regards

Chris 

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According to the war diary of 33rd Brigade, RFA  (WO 95/1694) Captain C A E Cadell of 36th Battery, 33rd Brigade, RFA transferred to 75th Brigade, RFA of the Guards Division on 20 February 1916.

 

Regards, Dick Flory

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Great responses from the others above, especially Chris. The signature must be a poor translation of one by Siegne. It is too much of a coincidence that both men were with C/75. It is also amazing that we have pinpointed a very likely battery from the scant information in the service record.

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Thank you so much.. Ill have a look through the Diaries.. so i can find out where he was, and what he did..

He Made it back from the war, and apparantly never spoke about his time .. but he was brilliant with horses.. Before and after the war.. 

As he was a driver, I take it he wouldnt have been 'In the trenches'?..

 

Thank you all again x 

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Roll of Honour and Casualties and List of Officers Who Have Served with 75th Brigade RFA Guards Division France and Belgium 24th August to 11th December 1918 indicates that  Major T R B Seigne was BC of C/75 during that entire period and was wounded at Louverval on 11 Sept 1918.  Captain Cadell is not indicated as being with the Brigade during that period.

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Great Richard,

 

I do hope this thread has helped your research. I firmly believe that Captain R. B Seigal and Major T. R. B. Segne are one and the same and that he was a long term member of C/75.

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There is also the book 'Guns,Kites and Horses; 3 Diaries from the Western Front' by Sidney Giffard. I don't have the book (yet- its on my list) but one of the diaries is by EH Giffard, an officer in C/75. Perhaps it throws light on the subject?

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Yes thank you all.. Ive spent most of today reading war diaries!.. Very interesting..  Ive tried to plot out where the c/75 were.. and what he did, they even say how many rounds they had to use!

I will look into that book too!..

 

Thank you again.. I cant wait to tell my dad (his Grandson) all about this at the weekend!

 

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Guns,Kites and Horses; 3 Diaries from the Western Front mentions Major T R B Seigne twelve times: the first mention is dated 31 July 1917; the last is dated 11 September 1918 when Seigne was wounded.  The book makes it quite clear that he served with C/75 throughout this time. Cadell is not mentioned in the book.

 

 

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